20 Aug
2020
20 Aug
'20
4:09 p.m.
Is the style command (and perhaps other DWB programs) legally available
anywhere?
Replies to me will be summarized for the list. :)
tnx.
20 Aug
20 Aug
4:45 p.m.
I was recently looking at the C compiler in v10 in the TUHS archives and I
believe it's in there.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 10:11 AM Richard Salz <rich.salz(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Is the style command (and perhaps other DWB programs)
legally available
anywhere?
Replies to me will be summarized for the list. :)
tnx.
5:14 p.m.
The DWB distribution from the Toolkit is not around to my knowledge, but:
https://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=V8/usr/src/cmd look for the
diction and style directories, which should be close.
Note to Warren, probably should create and area for the Toolkit codes and
see if we can start to collect them, such as a few versions of ksh, DWB,
different games for the JERQ, *et al.* I wish I had a list of everything
that was in it, but if we all go looking we might be able to pull much of
that material together.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 10:45 AM Jim Geist <velocityboy(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I was recently looking at the C compiler in v10 in the
TUHS archives and I
believe it's in there.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 10:11 AM Richard Salz <rich.salz(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Is the style command (and perhaps other DWB programs) legally available
> anywhere?
>
> Replies to me will be summarized for the list. :)
>
> tnx.
>
>
5:44 p.m.
On Thu, 20 Aug 2020, Clem Cole wrote:
Note to Warren, probably should create and area for
the Toolkit codes and
see if we can start to collect them, such as a few versions of ksh, DWB,
different games for the JERQ, *et al.* I wish I had a list of everything
that was in it, but if we all go looking we might be able to pull much of
that material together.
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying to kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
-uso.
6:08 p.m.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas <usotsuki(a)buric.co> wrote:
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying to
kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the build process is now.
America is not a morally pure country. No country ever has been or ever
will be, but in democratic countries you get things done by compromising
your principles in order to form alliances with groups about whom you
have grave doubts. --Richard Rorty, Achieving Our Country (1998)
6:30 p.m.
On Thu, 20 Aug 2020, John Cowan wrote:
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas
<usotsuki(a)buric.co> wrote:
It's still a shell script. Big huge shell script.
I was trying to simplify the build process because I'm trying to coax ksh
to build with a nonstandard cc/libc combination as part of an attempt to
make Linux more like "real" (read: commercial/historic) Unices. They're
pretty compatible with gcc and glibc, but they're not gcc and glibc.
-uso.
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying
to kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the build process is now.
6:48 p.m.
That suggests to me like factoring the script would be the first place to
start.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 12:30 PM Steve Nickolas <usotsuki(a)buric.co> wrote:
On Thu, 20 Aug 2020, John Cowan wrote:
It's still a shell script. Big huge shell script.
I was trying to simplify the build process because I'm trying to coax ksh
to build with a nonstandard cc/libc combination as part of an attempt to
make Linux more like "real" (read: commercial/historic) Unices. They're
pretty compatible with gcc and glibc, but they're not gcc and glibc.
-uso.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas
<usotsuki(a)buric.co>
wrote:
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying
to kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the build process is now. 
9:42 p.m.
On 8/20/20 12:08 PM, John Cowan wrote:
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas <usotsuki(a)buric.co
<mailto:usotsuki@buric.co>> wrote:
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying to kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
He might have started with make for ksh83 and 86, but switched to Fowler's
nmake and then shipped that /bin/sh script in ksh88 for people (everyone,
basically) who didn't have nmake.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the build
process is now.
Changing that was one of the controversial modifications made to ksh93 in
ksh-2020. It's pretty complex.
Here's a paper that describes part of it:
https://www.usenix.org/legacy/publications/library/proceedings/vhll/full_pa…
--
``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer
``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
Chet Ramey, UTech, CWRU chet(a)case.edu http://tiswww.cwru.edu/~chet/
21 Aug
21 Aug
1:15 a.m.
Unfortunately Ghostscript can't convert that .ps file to a PDF.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 3:42 PM Chet Ramey <chet.ramey(a)case.edu> wrote:
On 8/20/20 12:08 PM, John Cowan wrote:
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas <usotsuki(a)buric.co
<mailto:usotsuki@buric.co>> wrote:
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying to kitbash ksh93 into
being
able to compile with make instead of the
funky build system it
currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
He might have started with make for ksh83 and 86, but switched to Fowler's
nmake and then shipped that /bin/sh script in ksh88 for people (everyone,
basically) who didn't have nmake.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the
build process is now.
Changing that was one of the controversial modifications made to ksh93 in
ksh-2020. It's pretty complex.
Here's a paper that describes part of it:
https://www.usenix.org/legacy/publications/library/proceedings/vhll/full_pa…
--
``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer
``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
Chet Ramey, UTech, CWRU chet(a)case.edu http://tiswww.cwru.edu/~chet/
1:17 a.m.
On 8/20/20 7:15 PM, John Cowan wrote:
Unfortunately Ghostscript can't convert that .ps
file to a PDF.
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/John_Snyder16/publication/261861597_Fe…
See if that works better.
--
``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer
``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
Chet Ramey, UTech, CWRU chet(a)case.edu http://tiswww.cwru.edu/~chet/
1:20 a.m.
There is an email header in the file. If you edit it and remove everything before the
%!PS-Adobe-2.0 preamble, it will load with gs and converts perfectly to pdf with ps2pdf.
From: "John Cowan" <cowan(a)ccil.org>
To: "chet ramey" <chet.ramey(a)case.edu>
Cc: "The Eunuchs Hysterical Society" <tuhs(a)tuhs.org>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2020 7:15:11 PM
Subject: Re: [TUHS] Style command source available?
Unfortunately Ghostscript can't convert that .ps file to a PDF.
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 3:42 PM Chet Ramey < chet.ramey(a)case.edu > wrote:
On 8/20/20 12:08 PM, John Cowan wrote:
On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 11:55 AM Steve Nickolas < usotsuki(a)buric.co
<mailto: usotsuki(a)buric.co >> wrote:
Funny you mention ksh since I've been trying to kitbash ksh93 into being
able to compile with make instead of the funky build system it currently
uses, without a lot of luck.
IIRC, Korn used make when developing ksh, but then shipped it with a
/bin/sh script because it was more portable than make was in those days
(and still is; there are tools that warn you to use gmake on BSD). After
all, a build process (unless it is interrupted) just needs to build, it
doesn't need to keep track of what has already been built.
He might have started with make for ksh83 and 86, but switched to Fowler's
nmake and then shipped that /bin/sh script in ksh88 for people (everyone,
basically) who didn't have nmake.
That said, I have no idea what the state of the build
process is now.
Changing that was one of the controversial modifications made to ksh93 in
ksh-2020. It's pretty complex.
Here's a paper that describes part of it:
https://www.usenix.org/legacy/publications/library/proceedings/vhll/full_pa…
--
``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer
``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
Chet Ramey, UTech, CWRU chet(a)case.edu http://tiswww.cwru.edu/~chet/
4:42 p.m.
On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 5:22 AM Harald Arnesen <skogtun(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Naturally. But for hysterical raisins I stick to ASCII in my .sigs, and
anyway, the Latin version allows me to say "Arse longa, vita brevis" when
appropriate.
What Hippocrates definitely didn't say was "First, do no harm", though it
is close to something in the Epidemics which I have refrained from looking
up.
John Cowan http://vrici.lojban.org/~cowan cowan(a)ccil.org
No, John. I want formats that are actually useful, rather than over-
featured megaliths that address all questions by piling on ridiculous
internal links in forms which are hideously over-complex.
--Simon St. Laurent on xml-dev
``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
Of course, what Hippokrates really wrote was
"Ὁ βίος βραχύς, ἡ δὲ τέχνη μακρή"
5:23 p.m.
John Cowan wrote in
<CAD2gp_RQXUwqj9qFHHzbxgsfgKuSrejLXBWW0KJcJCO=Xkz=xw(a)mail.gmail.com>:
|On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 5:22 AM Harald Arnesen <skogtun(a)gmail.com> wrote:
|>> ``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates
|>
|> Of course, what Hippokrates really wrote was
|> "Ὁ βίος βραχύς, ἡ δὲ τέχνη μακρή"
|
|Naturally. But for hysterical raisins I stick to ASCII in my .sigs, and
|anyway, the Latin version allows me to say "Arse longa, vita brevis" when
|appropriate.
|
|What Hippocrates definitely didn't say was "First, do no harm", though
it
|is close to something in the Epidemics which I have refrained from looking
|up.
It was Schopenhauer who definetely said
Neminem laede, imo omnes, quantum potes, juva!
--steffen
|
|Der Kragenbaer, The moon bear,
|der holt sich munter he cheerfully and one by one
|einen nach dem anderen runter wa.ks himself off
|(By Robert Gernhardt)
1536
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14 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
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Chet Ramey -
Clem Cole -
Harald Arnesen -
Jim Capp -
Jim Geist -
John Cowan -
Richard Salz -
Steffen Nurpmeso -
Steve Nickolas