8 Jun
2000
8 Jun
'00
12:46 a.m.
jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de wrote:
One more thing I stuffed into the system. You'll also find
"sigaction" and friends along with RTS/CTS flowcontrol (for devices
which support it), and numerous other goodies imported from 4.4BSD (the
latest addition was 'pselect(2)' just a couple months ago).
Steven Schultz
sms(a)moe.2bsd.com
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And in those cases, you loose as well. The RX02 uses a micro-engine to
control the drive. No chip controller can switch density in the middle of
the track, so RX02 floppies will forever be in the domain of RX02 drives
only.
Note that formatting RX02 floppes is no problem, since you format them in
single density. The RX02 sets a bit in the header if the data is DD, and
this is controllable from all DEC OSes that I know of.
Johnny
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt(a)update.uu.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
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Oh, yes. My VS4000m60 needs only 36 hours to go
through a "make build".
This is pure luxury.=20
And 4.3BSD-Quasijarus completes its make build on my CSRG dev mill, which is a
KA655 (3.8 VUPs, whereas your KA46 is 12 VUPs), in a little under 4 hours. The
GENERIC vmunix kernel is another 30 minutes.
Long live Original UNIX in 4 capitals! Let's reopen the Soviet factories, build
new 11/780s with the hammer and sickle on every chip, put the real UNIX on
them, and send pee sea-raised revisionists to gulag!
--
Michael Sokolov Harhan Engineering Laboratory
Public Service Agent International Free Computing Task Force
International Engineering and Science Task Force
615 N GOOD LATIMER EXPY STE #4
DALLAS TX 75204-5852 USA
Phone: +1-214-824-7693 (Harhan Eng Lab office)
E-mail: msokolov(a)ivan.Harhan.ORG (ARPA TCP/SMTP) (UUCP coming soon)
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From Eric Fischer <enf(a)pobox.com> Thu Jun 8
08:50:45 2000
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From: Eric Fischer <enf(a)pobox.com>
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au
Subject: Re: unix precursors
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Thompson mentions that unix borrows heavily from CTSS.
I think that
Corbato wrote a book on this system, but that book seems nearly as
rare as chicken teeth. I think he also wrote an earlier journal
article on the system, which I imagine shouldn't be hard to locate.
The journal article you're thinking of is probably "An Experimental
Time Sharing System" by Corbato, Merwin-Daggett, and Daley, which
describes an early version of the system (where command arguments
were still separated by vertical bars instead of spaces). AFIPS
Conference Proceedings vol. 21, 1962.
The book is _The Compatible Time-Sharing System: A User's Guide_,
which was published in two editions in, I think, 1963 and 1965,
by MIT Press. Both editions are in enough libraries you should
be able to get them by interlibrary loan. The first edition is
more booklike, the second is more like a collection of man pages.
The Charles Babbage Institute has copies of some of the on-line
updates to the manual (on paper) from after the second edition
was published.
You will see many similarities to Unix. The arguments to tar,
for instance, come straight from the CTSS "ARCHIV" command.
Finally, Thompson also mentions that fork() basically
existed in its
current form in the Berkeley Timesharing System. That is the one and
only thing I have ever heard about this system. Anyone know where I
can learn more?
You can find out some things about it from Butler Lampson's "A User
Machine in a Time-Sharing System," at
http://www.research.microsoft.com/lampson/02-UserMachine/Abstract.html
Dennis Ritchie cites a real manual for the system in the references for
http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/hist.html
but I haven't been able to locate a copy, even in the library at
the University of California, Berkeley. I've read somewhere that
the system is supposed to be similar to the PDP-1 time sharing
system developed at MIT, but the only documentation I've located
on that is Mario Bonghi's master's thesis, which seems to have been
written before the hardware was even upgraded to be able to run
the software it describes.
eric
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From Paul West <pdub(a)accesscom.com> Thu Jun 8
09:36:42 2000
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"A. P. Garcia" wrote:
does anyone know where I can learn more about other
precursors to
unix?
On CTSS:
F. J. Corbato et al.
"An Experimental Time-Sharing System"
Proceedings of the AFIPS, SJCC 1962, vol 21, pp 335-344.
P. A. Crisman
The Compatible Time-Sharing System: A Programmer's Guide, 2nd ed.
MIT Press, 1965.
On the Berkeley Timesharing System:
W.W. Lichtenberger and M. W. Pirtle
"A Facility for Experimentation in Man-Machine Interaction"
Proceedings of the AFIPS, FJCC 1965, vol 27, pp 185-196.
B. W. Lampson, W.W. Lichtenberger and M. W. Pirtle
"A User Machine in a Time-Sharing System"
Proceedings of the IEEE, vol 54 no 12 (Dec. 1966), pp 1766-1774.
This last paper is reprinted in Chapter 24 of:
C. Gordon Bell and Allen Newell
Computer Structures: Readings and Examples
Mc-Graw Hill, 1971
and this *entire* book is online at
"http://www.research.microsoft.com/~gbell/Computer_Structures__Readings_and_Examples/contents.html"
(the URL needs to be all on one line to cut and paste into your
browser).
Happy reading :)
Paul
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12:27:45 2000
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Eric Fischer wrote:
I've read somewhere that
the system is supposed to be similar to the PDP-1 time sharing
system developed at MIT, but the only documentation I've located
on that is Mario Bonghi's master's thesis, which seems to have been
written before the hardware was even upgraded to be able to run
the software it describes.
The book "Computer Engineering" by Bell, Mudge and McNamara gives
another reference for the MIT PDP-1 timesharing system:
J.B. Dennis,
"A Multiuser Computation Facility for Education and Research"
Comm. ACM, vol. 7 no. 9 (Sept. 1964), pp 521-529.
BTW, there apparently were two different timesharing systems developed
for the PDP-1, the second one coming from Bolt, Beranek, and Newman
(BBN). "Computer Engineering" gives this reference for the BBN system:
J. McCarthy, S. Boilen, E. Fredkin, and J.C.R. Lieklider
"A Timesharing Debugging System for a Small Computer"
AFIPS Conference Proceedings, SJCC 1963, vol 23, pp 51-57.
Yes, that is John McCarthy of LISP fame.
Paul
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From "Steven M. Schultz"
<sms(a)moe.2bsd.com> Thu Jun 8 14:45:32 2000
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To: jasomill(a)shaffstall.com, sms(a)moe.2bsd.com
Subject: Re: RX50 on RQDX3 on 2.11BSD
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Hi -
From: "Jason T. Miller"
<jasomill(a)shaffstall.com>
> Wow, quite a bit of interest in 2.11 these days - I suppose I should
It's the first PDP operating system I've
enjoyed working with, and one of
the coolest UNIX implementations I've had the pleasure of working with.
Ah, thanks! I can't claim _all_ the credit but 2.10.1 was more or
less directly my "fault" and 2.11 was all set to be called 2.11SMS
until one of the CSRG folks intervened and gave me the BSD imprimateur.
I unearthed two Teac 55-G series floppy drives, and
they're both broken
(won't format w/verify) -- the RX50 isn't the only flakey floppy. I've got
Sigh.
Anyhow, to the problem you observed dd'ing data to an RX50 and the
ensuing compare error.
I'm using an RX33 (well, mod'd Teac 5.25" drive) on a RQDX3.
I freshly formatted a floppy. That's one nice thing about the RX33,
the RQDX3 can format floppies using ZRQF?? - RX50's meant getting
preformat'd media or a Rainbow to do the formatting from what I
remember.
Then before doing anything I enabled a bit of extended logging from
the MSCP driver with
sysctl -w machdep.mscp.printf=9
The first access to the drive ("disklabel ra9") elicited a
"ra9a=entire disk: no disk label" message. This is expected and
correct - the kernel saw there was a corrupt/missing label and came
up with a label that spanned the 2400 sectors of the drive using the
'a' partition.
Next a 1.2mb file (sector 0 having zeroes, sector 1 having ones, etc)
was dd'd:
dd if=/tmp/data of=/dev/rra9a
and almost immediately dd reported:
write: Read-only file system
2+0 records in
2+0 records out
That probably should have been 2+0 and 1+0 since dd read two sectors but
only successfully wrote one. A bug in 'dd' perhaps that it doesn't
decrement the output count on a write error.
At any rate you should error out if the label area is not write
enabled. The 'disklabel' program automatically enables and disables
the writeprotect when writing the label in case you were wondering
about that ;)
After doing the "disklabel -W ra9" the "dd" works fine and the
floppy
compares identical to the input file.
The MSCP driver hasn't changed in quite a while so if you retrieved
2.11 fairly recently the problem's not a bug in ra.c that I can
see (or if it is, it's particular to the RX50 somehow).
Why 'ra9' (I hear you ask)? Well, the system is currently booted
from a different controller (Emulex UC08). The boot controller is
*always* 'ra0 thru ra7' no matter what the CSR is. The secondary
controller (the RQDX3 in this case) is always 'ra8 thru ra15'. The
RD54 is 'ra8' (first drive on the 2nd controller) and the RX33 is
ra9 (second drive on the second controller).
Oh, for
debugging purposes you can enable more or all of the MSCP
messages with the 'sysctl' command:
sysctl -w machdep.mscp.printf=X
I will. Thanks. I didn't even know 2.11 had 'sysctl'. Cool. From lars brinkhoff <lars(a)nocrew.org> Thu Jun 8
15:41:44 2000
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From: lars brinkhoff <lars(a)nocrew.org>
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+0000"
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"A. P. Garcia" <apgarcia(a)hackaholic.org> writes:
I know that www.multicians.org is a nice web site
devoted to Multics,
but does anyone know where I can learn more about other precursors to
unix?
How about ITS, did it influence Unix?
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From Johnny Billquist <bqt(a)Update.UU.SE> Thu Jun
8 17:13:02 2000
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From: Johnny Billquist <bqt(a)Update.UU.SE>
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On Wed, 7 Jun 2000, Roger Ivie wrote:
Speaking of
PITA
device control, wasn't it the DEC RX02 that wrote address information in
single density and data in DD?
Yes, it was. But it was usually done by the hardware (I suppose that
would be microcode in the case of the RX02), so unless you wanted to
do something foolish like read RX02 diskettes in your DD CP/M machine
or format floppies you don't have to worry about it.