11 May
1998
11 May
'98
2:47 a.m.
On May 10, 9:49, Steven M. Schultz wrote:
alternative
Subject: Re: Floating Point-The Results Are In!
> From: Johnny Billquist <bqt(a)Update.UU.SE>
> I wouldn't be *that* surprised by these results. For instance, I
believe
> that longs are implemented with FP. And I
wouldn't be surprised if a
few
FP ops were
sneaked in to compute some stuff that aren't immediately
appearant.
It is true that _some_ long arithmetic is done using FP. The long
divide is done that way (at least in 2BSD, I've not looked at V7
yet) because it is much much less code to convert the operands to
FP, do the divide, and then convert the result back (the is about two pages of code).
The C compiler itself did NOT generate FP unless the
operands were
explicitly FP (float or double). Most C code was 'int' or 'char *'
and no FP code was needed or used for that.
That bears out what I disovered by accident yesterday -- looking at a 7th
Edition UK source distribution for 11/23's and other small machines. The
READ_ME file lists the programs that have possible floating point problems,
or which might be too big using emulation. I can't remember the details,
but the list had a few surprises.
Most of the C programs have very little FP, and that is mostly due to a
small number of library routines that include FP ops, but one or two
programs are exceptional.
For example, 'factor' has a lot of FP at the beginning, a chunk in the
middle, and a large subroutine near the end, which uses FP to compute
square roots using Newton's method. factor is written in assembler, not C,
and has much more FP than other things I looked at, but several other
programs use a little.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mon
May 11 08:58:57 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199805102258.IAA02806(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: PUPS Mail List welcome + news
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 08:58:57 +1000 (EST)
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We've had a regular intake of new subscribers to the PUPS mailing list, so
I thought I'd say Welcome to all the newcomers. There are now 90 people on
the list, and the quantity of messages is increasing daily.
The mailing list is also available in a digest form, which is distributed
twice a week. If you would rather be on the digest list, send mail to
majordomo(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au with the lines in the body of the mail:
unsubscribe pups
subscribe pups-digest
For more information about old UNIX, see the PUPS web pages at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS, and the FAQ in particular.
The most recent news is that both Bob Supnik and the Begemot team have
released new versions of their PDP-11 emulators. A further bug in Bob's
emulator was found by Steven Schultz, so we might see a patch to the
emulator coming out soon.
The PUPS volunteers have been hard at work burning and mailing out the
first batch of CDs containing the PUPS Archive, which is now about 520Megs
in size. We also have about 30 people with authorised access into the
on-line PUPS Archive.
Dion at SCO has promised another batch of new UNIX licenses, which I
should receive in the next few days. When I do, I'll post the details here.
That's all for now. Ciao,
Warren
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mon
May 11 09:41:19 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199805102341.JAA02987(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: PUPS Mail List welcome + news
To: jkatz(a)darpanet.net (J. Joseph Max Katz)
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:41:19 +1000 (EST)
Cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.3.96.980510164539.6267A-100000(a)corinne.cpio.org> from
"J. Joseph Max Katz" at "May 10, 98 04:47:31 pm"
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In article by J. Joseph Max Katz:
Hi,
What's the latest on the 4BSD re-release that Marshal Kirk McKusick
is doing?
I've sent the list of people interested to Kirk. He's still a bit vague,
but is looking at selling a 4-CD set of all the 4BSD releases for a
price around US$100. That's a ballpark number, and will depend on how many
people want the set: the more the cheaper it will be.
I haven't heard back from him for a week or so. Should I ask him what
he is planning?
Please, none of this is for public consumption just yet.
Cheers,
Warren
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From Bob Supnik <Bob.Supnik(a)digital.com> Tue May
12 05:01:14 1998
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From: Bob Supnik <Bob.Supnik(a)digital.com>
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: vi bug found
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 15:01:14 -0400
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For those who want vi to work before V2.3c is released, the problem is
in the divide instruction. Look for:
dst = src / src2;
if ((dst >= 077777) || (dst < -0100000)) {
and change the second line to:
if ((dst > 077777) || (dst < -0100000)) {
(Thanks to Steve Schultz for finding this.)
The magtape bootstrap is also broken, that will be fixed in V2.3c as
well.
/Bob Supnik
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From "Daniel A. Seagraves"
<DSEAGRAV(a)toad.xkl.com> Tue May 12 10:55:24 1998
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:55:24 -0700
From: "Daniel A. Seagraves" <DSEAGRAV(a)toad.xkl.com>
Subject: Just got my license from SCO...
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
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I'm number AU-31.
-------
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From "Ed G." <edgee(a)cyberpass.net> Tue
May 12 12:21:12 1998
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From: "Ed G." <edgee(a)cyberpass.net>
To: Greg Lehey <grog(a)lemis.com>
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Subject: Re: Floating Point-The Results Are In!
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CC: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
In-reply-to: <19980508194615.O12200(a)freebie.lemis.com>
References: <199805080414.AAA28438(a)renoir.op.net>; from Ed G. on Fri, May 08, 1998
at 12:14:03AM -0400
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I don't know what the code above is intended to
do, but it's not
floating point. At the very best, it would indicate the use of the
floating point registers for straightforward data moves. I stand by
my assertion that tar doesn't use floating point, neither in the
Seventh Edition nor elsewhere.
I agree: tar doesn't *use* floating point.
However, from what I can determine the floating point ops in tar are
not some weird way of moving data around, nor is floating point
being used to do long arithmetic as some have suggested.
Compare the first few tar floating point ops with a dummy program
consisting of a single call to scanf:
tar, 106 floating point ops:
0: SETD ;170011
20532: STCFD F0,(R1) ;176011
20562: STF F0,(R1) ;174011
22406: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
22410: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
22460: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
22462: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
22620: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
22622: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
24124: LDF F0,4(R5) ;172465 000004
24130: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
26616: LDF F0,#56200 ;172427 056200
26622: STF F0,177732(R5) ;174065 177732
etc.
scanf, 106 floating point ops:
000000: SETD ;170011
002764: STCFD F0,(R1) ;176011
003014: STF F0,(R1) ;174011
004346: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
004350: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
004420: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
004422: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
004560: LDF F0,(R4)+ ;172424
004562: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
004750: LDF F0,4(R5) ;172465 000004
004754: STF F0,-(SP) ;174046
006410: LDF F0,#56200 ;172427 056200
006414: STF F0,177732(R5) ;174065 177732
So it would appear that whatever floating point there is in tar comes
from library routines which have been linked in, but which tar does
not use.
"When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras."
Ed
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu
May 14 10:59:28 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199805140059.KAA08059(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: More licenses from SCO
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 10:59:28 +1000 (EST)
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I've received some more UNIX source licenses from SCO. The new licencees are:
Craig Bevans, Brian Chase, Efton Collins, Peter Collinson,
David Galloway, Jay Jaeger, Dieter Muller, Daniel Seagraves,
Jason Stevens, Warren Toomey, Christopher Vance, Norman Wilson,
Thomas Zenker.
As always, if you are interested in obtaining access to the on-line PUPS
Archive, or a copy of it on some form of media (CD, tape etc.), then
please mail your request to pupsarchive(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au. You will
receive an automated response with more details.
The PUPS Volunteers have sent out about 6 CDs so far, and one tape(?).
Cheers all,
Warren
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu
May 14 11:03:12 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199805140103.LAA08094(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: More licenses from SCO
To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:03:12 +1000 (EST)
Cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
In-Reply-To: <199805140059.KAA08059(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> from Warren Toomey at
"May 14, 98 10:59:28 am"
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In article by Warren Toomey:
I've received some more UNIX source licenses from
SCO. The new licencees are:
I forgot to say: Dion gave me license number AU-0, at the behest of
the members of the PUPS mailing list. Thanks all!!
Warren
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From Beastly Wolf <beast(a)lintilla2.df.lth.se> Mon
May 18 19:54:06 1998
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From: Beastly Wolf <beast(a)lintilla2.df.lth.se>
To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
cc: PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Exploited by spammers.
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Hi all!
I want to tell you all how sorry I am for spamming occuring from this site.
Due to several reasons it was possible to exploit the lintilla service
machines.
We hope we have put an end to it now (it was not an easy task since it
involved *cringe* beurocracy).
If anybody receives spams from lintilla.df.lth.se or lintilla2.df.lth.se
from now on please let me know! It should not happen but....
The lintilla services machines does not approve to spam and we try to
fight back as hard as we are able.
Internet used to be a happy place where people helped eachother and where
life was simple and good. Sometimes I long for those days now gone. =(
Today it seems that greed and abuse is the rule...
Again, sorry for the inconvenience that spamming from this site has caused!
Sincerely yours:
Lars Persson, the Lintilla services.
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From "Ian King"
<iking(a)killthewabbit.org> Tue May 19 12:50:09 1998
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From: "Ian King" <iking(a)killthewabbit.org>
To: "PDP Unix Preservation" <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Question regarding tape drive interface
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 19:50:09 -0700
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OK, this may not be *exactly* the right place to ask this.....
I'm in the process of acquiring a PDP-11/34, on which I intend to run *some* flavor
of UNIX. I also have a Cipher F-880 tape drive, which I would like to interface with the
PDP-11. Reading between the lines of several pages on the Web, it seems it should be
possible to do this, but which module is required? And does that prescribe the version of
UNIX I'll be able to run? Thanks in advance for any experience you can share!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case. Coincidence?
Ian King <iking(a)KillTheWabbit.org> No opinions but my own. So there.
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From Robin Birch <robin(a)falstaf.demon.co.uk> Wed
May 20 05:33:00 1998
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Cc: PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
From: Robin Birch <robin(a)falstaf.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Question regarding tape drive interface
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In message <199805190148.SAA10957(a)forbin.killthewabbit.org>, Ian King
<iking(a)killthewabbit.org> writes
OK, this may not be *exactly* the right place to ask
this.....
I'm in the process of acquiring a PDP-11/34, on which I intend to run *some*
flavor of UNIX. I also have a Cipher F-880 tape drive, which I would like to
interface with the PDP-11. Reading between the lines of several pages on the
Web, it seems it should be possible to do this, but which module is required?
And does that prescribe the version of UNIX I'll be able to run? Thanks in
advance for any experience you can share!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------
24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case. Coincidence?
Ian King <iking(a)KillTheWabbit.org> No opinions but my own. So there.
Wotcher,
You'll need a UNIBUS TS11 card, I don't know the number for this but it
should be relatively easy to get hold of. BSD2 certainly supports this.
Cheers
Robin
Robin Birch robin(a)falstaf.demon.co.uk
M1ASU/2E0ARJ Old computers and radios always welcome
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri
May 29 13:12:02 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199805290312.NAA01694(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: More UNIX Licenses
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:12:02 +1000 (EST)
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I've just received licenses from SCO for Don Cruickshank and Hartmut Brandt.
Congrats, you two!
Ciao,
Warren
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu
Jun 18 12:54:57 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199806180254.MAA04029(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: More UNIX Licenses
To: djenner(a)halcyon.com
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 12:54:57 +1000 (EST)
Cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <35887E29.828B78E2(a)halcyon.com> from "David C. Jenner" at
"Jun 17, 98 07:40:41 pm"
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In article by David C. Jenner:
Warren,
I haven't received any PUPS mailing list since this message.
(May 28th). Are things that slow?
It's been quiet! However, I'll send in a test message to wake everybody up :-)
Ciao,
Warren
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From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mon
Jul 6 13:58:23 1998
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199807060358.NAA07988(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: More SCO Licenses + Software Tools
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 13:58:23 +1000 (EST)
Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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All,
The following people now have SCO source licenses for ancient Unix:
Bruce Robertson, Erick Delios, Kelwin Wylie, Kirsten McIntyre, Matthew Crosby
That brings the numbering scheme up to AU-50, but in fact there are 52
SCO source licenses for ancient Unix.
The mailing list has been pretty quiet. Hope you're all well. The only
news I have is that Norman Wilson is still slowly scanning in the manuals
from 2nd to 5th Edition. He now has most (all?) of 5th edition scanned in.
I haven't heard from Kirk McKusick, but he's still planning to sell a 4CD
set of all the 4BSD releases from CSRG. The cost is still expected to be
around US$100, but if he gets flooded with requests, this may come down.
Software Tools
--------------
I got some mail last week from Deborah Scherrer:
I was one of the people who created the Software
Tools project and Software Tools Users Group (Peter Salus
mentioned us in his book). If you're interested, you might
want to include the Software Tools tapes in your collection.
She suggested that I contact Barbera Chase, which I did.
Barbera (bc(a)mrdata.netcetera.com) then wrote:
Sorry, we don't actually have any of the files online anymore, nor do we
have access to a tape drive. What we have are 9-track tapes, probably in
1600bpi. There are three versions of the tools for PDP machines, one for
RSX-11 and two for "generic" Unix. I still happen to have several copies
of each, and will be glad to send them to you. Just let me know where to
send them, and if you happen to have a shipping account number that would
be even better ;-)
I don't know Barbera's geographic location. However, would anybody in the
US be prepared to read these tapes for us, and pass the contents to me for
inclusion in the PUPS Archive??!
Cheers all,
Warren
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From Greg Lehey <grog(a)lemis.com> Mon Jul 6
14:18:28 1998
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From: Greg Lehey <grog(a)lemis.com>
To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au, PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: More SCO Licenses + Software Tools
References: <199807060358.NAA07988(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
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Jul 06, 1998 at 01:58:23PM +1000
WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog
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On Monday, 6 July 1998 at 13:58:23 +1000, Warren Toomey wrote:
Software Tools
--------------
I got some mail last week from Deborah Scherrer:
I was one of the people who created the Software
Tools project and Software Tools Users Group (Peter Salus
mentioned us in his book). If you're interested, you might
want to include the Software Tools tapes in your collection.
She suggested that I contact Barbera Chase, which I did.
Barbera (bc(a)mrdata.netcetera.com) then wrote:
Sorry, we don't actually have any of the files online anymore, nor do we
have access to a tape drive. What we have are 9-track tapes, probably in
1600bpi. There are three versions of the tools for PDP machines, one for
RSX-11 and two for "generic" Unix. I still happen to have several copies
of each, and will be glad to send them to you. Just let me know where to
send them, and if you happen to have a shipping account number that would
be even better ;-)
I don't know Barbera's geographic location. However, would anybody in the
US be prepared to read these tapes for us, and pass the contents to me for
inclusion in the PUPS Archive??!
Registrant:
Netcetera, Inc. (NETCETERA-DOM)
11950 Anderson Valley Way
P.O. Box 939
Boonville, CA 95415
Domain Name: NETCETERA.COM
Administrative Contact:
Chase, Barbara L. (BC309) bc(a)NETCETERA.COM
707-895-2691
Greg
--
See complete headers for address and phone numbers
finger grog(a)lemis.com for PGP public key
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From "David C. Jenner"
<djenner(a)halcyon.com> Tue Jul 7 05:15:30 1998
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CC: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au, PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: More SCO Licenses + Software Tools
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I think having these in the archives would be great. I used the
Software Tools extensively back in the late 70's and early 80's.
I wish I could read the tapes in, but I'm still working on a tape
drive for an 11/73. (see separate mail.)
Dave
Greg Lehey wrote:
On Monday, 6 July 1998 at 13:58:23 +1000, Warren Toomey wrote:
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Software Tools
--------------
I got some mail last week from Deborah Scherrer:
I was one of the people who created the Software
Tools project and Software Tools Users Group (Peter Salus
mentioned us in his book). If you're interested, you might
want to include the Software Tools tapes in your collection.
She suggested that I contact Barbera Chase, which I did.
Barbera (bc(a)mrdata.netcetera.com) then wrote:
Sorry, we don't actually have any of the files online anymore, nor do we
have access to a tape drive. What we have are 9-track tapes, probably in
1600bpi. There are three versions of the tools for PDP machines, one for
RSX-11 and two for "generic" Unix. I still happen to have several copies
of each, and will be glad to send them to you. Just let me know where to
send them, and if you happen to have a shipping account number that would
be even better ;-)
I don't know Barbera's geographic location. However, would anybody in the
US be prepared to read these tapes for us, and pass the contents to me for
inclusion in the PUPS Archive??!
Registrant:
Netcetera, Inc. (NETCETERA-DOM)
11950 Anderson Valley Way
P.O. Box 939
Boonville, CA 95415
Domain Name: NETCETERA.COM
Administrative Contact:
Chase, Barbara L. (BC309) bc(a)NETCETERA.COM
707-895-2691
Greg
--
See complete headers for address and phone numbers
finger grog(a)lemis.com for PGP public key From "David C. Jenner"
<djenner(a)halcyon.com> Tue Jul 7 05:30:18 1998
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Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 12:30:18 -0700
From: "David C. Jenner" <djenner(a)halcyon.com>
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To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au, PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Generating 2.11BSD boot tape
References: <199807060358.NAA07988(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
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There hasn't been much traffic here for a while, so maybe I can stir
things up a bit.
I recently acquired a fabulous 9-track tape drive, an M4 9914, which
has both a SCSI and a Pertec interface. This drive is so smart I
spent a couple of hours playing with it without it being hooked up to
any computer.
What's nice is that I can presumably get around the "high-cost"
bottleneck of using a tape drive on both a PDP-11 and Intel
machines: use the SCSI interface on the PC where the interface is
cheap (already exists) and use the Pertec interface on the -11 where
the interface is cheap (already exists). Using the opposite interface
on each machine could run up to a total of $2000 US.
So, what I want to do is read my PUPS archive CD-ROM on an Intel
machine and write appropriate 9-track tapes for the -11. The stumbling
block seems to be software on the Intel side. SCSI software packages
for MS-DOS or Windows 3.1/95/98/NT run $600, $800, even $1500US.
There must be a way of doing a CD-to-Tape generation with a simple
C-language program using one of the "free" OSes: Linux, FreeBSD,
SCO UnixWare, etc.
If anyone has any experience or ideas with this, I would appreciate
your input. It would be very easy for me to install and use one of
these OSs on a spare 486 I have. The question is, which is the most
likely to support SCSI on 9-track tape.
Thanks,
Dave
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From Greg Lehey <grog(a)lemis.com> Tue Jul 7
10:13:04 1998
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From: Greg Lehey <grog(a)lemis.com>
To: djenner(a)halcyon.com, wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au,
PDP Unix Preservation <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Which PC UNIX for old SCSI tape drive? (was: Generating 2.11BSD boot tape)
References: <199807060358.NAA07988(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
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1998 at 12:30:18PM -0700
WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog
Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia
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Fax: +61-8-8388-8725
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On Monday, 6 July 1998 at 12:30:18 -0700, David C. Jenner wrote:
There hasn't been much traffic here for a while,
so maybe I can stir
things up a bit.
I recently acquired a fabulous 9-track tape drive, an M4 9914, which
has both a SCSI and a Pertec interface. This drive is so smart I
spent a couple of hours playing with it without it being hooked up to
any computer.
What's nice is that I can presumably get around the "high-cost"
bottleneck of using a tape drive on both a PDP-11 and Intel
machines: use the SCSI interface on the PC where the interface is
cheap (already exists) and use the Pertec interface on the -11 where
the interface is cheap (already exists). Using the opposite interface
on each machine could run up to a total of $2000 US.
So, what I want to do is read my PUPS archive CD-ROM on an Intel
machine and write appropriate 9-track tapes for the -11. The stumbling
block seems to be software on the Intel side. SCSI software packages
for MS-DOS or Windows 3.1/95/98/NT run $600, $800, even $1500US.
There must be a way of doing a CD-to-Tape generation with a simple
C-language program using one of the "free" OSes: Linux, FreeBSD,
SCO UnixWare, etc.
Sure, that's the obvious way to go.
If anyone has any experience or ideas with this, I
would appreciate
your input. It would be very easy for me to install and use one of
these OSs on a spare 486 I have. The question is, which is the most
likely to support SCSI on 9-track tape.
I think you'll find that they all support SCSI. I'd recommend FreeBSD
because I'm involved with it and because it's the closest to 2.11BSD.
Next, I'd recommend Linux, because you have the sources. You could
have trouble with UnixWare, in which case there wouldn't be much you
could do about it. If you do have any problems with FreeBSD, let me
know and I'll see what I can do.
Greg
--
See complete headers for address and phone numbers
finger grog(a)lemis.com for PGP public key
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From Kevin Murrell <kevin(a)xpuppy.demon.co.uk> Tue
Jul 7 16:20:53 1998
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From: Kevin Murrell <kevin(a)xpuppy.demon.co.uk>
To: "'PDP Unix Preservation'" <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: DEC in the UK and Dilog
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 07:20:53 +0100
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Can anyone shed any light on a company called Dilog. Having acquired two Dilog machines
they appear to actually both be PDP-11s. Dilog seemed to have produced DEC compatible
hardware for the UK market.
In particular the smaller machine was known as a Vixen. This would appear to be a
PDP-11/73 with the DEC M8192 processor card. Indeed the processor card is the only
actual DEC product. Colleagues that used this machine described it as the portable
PDP-11 - however we are not talking laptop here :)
The 'Vixen' has a Dilog disk controller with a Seagate ST251 attached. The
machine is currently running DSM-11 and recognises the drive as a RA81.
I hope to produce a list relating the Dilog part numbers to original DEC part numbers.
Any help or suggestions gratefully received.
Kevin Murrell
Birmingham, England.
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From "User Rdkeys Robert D. Keys"
<rdkeys(a)seedlab1.cropsci.ncsu.edu> Wed Jul 8 01:44:14 1998
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Subject: Newbie Alert: Which is a ``best'' pdp-11 to look for?????
In-Reply-To: <199807060358.NAA07988(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> from Warren Toomey at
"Jul 6, 98 01:58:23 pm"
To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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All,
The following people now have SCO source licenses for ancient Unix:
Neato.... I am beginning to think it might be a fun thing to do.
As the newbie aboard, what pdp-11, vax, or other dec machine would be
one to shoot for. Some are largish beasts, but for the Joe Homehobby
type that wants to run one in the basement, what would be a reasonable
combination of parts or units (or a whole machine) to look for?
Occasionally machines float up from the bilges here in central NC, USA,
and usually they wind up dumpster fodder. Rather than see that happen,
if I had a choice, what should I be looking for? For convenience, if
there was something that would fit in half a relay rack or so, that
might be nice. Also, if it could run with standard cartridge tapes
(DC300/450/600) sized things, that would be advantageous, since I have
a number of those things and nil reel to reel drives.
I haven't heard from Kirk McKusick, but he's
still planning to sell a 4CD
set of all the 4BSD releases from CSRG. The cost is still expected to be
around US$100, but if he gets flooded with requests, this may come down.
That would be something worthwhile to have, just for posterity.
Software Tools
--------------
......
I don't know Barbera's geographic location.
However, would anybody in the
US be prepared to read these tapes for us, and pass the contents to me for
inclusion in the PUPS Archive??!
I just checked our folks.... nil reel-to-reel drives anymore..... shucks.
One of the technical high schools has the only one left here in NC.
Bob Keys
p.s. Are there any USA NC folks on the list, or just me?
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From "Steven M. Schultz"
<sms(a)moe.2bsd.com> Wed Jul 8 10:14:47 1998
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Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 17:14:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Steven M. Schultz" <sms(a)moe.2bsd.com>
Message-Id: <199807080014.RAA05047(a)moe.2bsd.com>
To: kevin(a)xpuppy.demon.co.uk, pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: Re: DEC in the UK and Dilog
Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
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Hi -
From: Kevin Murrell <kevin(a)xpuppy.demon.co.uk>
Linebreaks please? 72-80 columns would be nice ;)
Can anyone shed any light on a company called Dilog.
Not sure if they're still in the DEC business but at one time they
were one of the major 3rd party vendors making Qbus and Unibus
controllers.
Having acquired two Dilog machines they appear to
actually both be PDP-11s.
Dilog seemed to have produced DEC compatible hardware for the UK market.
I never heard of Dilog making entire systems. You'd typically buy
the box from DEC (but without any controllers or as few as you could
order a system from DEC with) and then stuff it with Emulex or Dilog
adaptors.
In particular the smaller machine was known as a
Vixen.
Sounds like an OEM somewhere was buying bare systems from DEC and
placing Dilog cards in them.
This would appear to be a PDP-11/73 with the DEC
M8192 processor card.
Indeed it is.
Indeed the processor card is the only actual DEC
product.
Colleagues that used this machine described it as the portable PDP-11 -
however we are not talking laptop here :)
What are the dimensions? It likely is a BA-23 box. "Transportable"
would be appropriate - unless you've a *huge* (and sturdy) lap ;)
The 'Vixen' has a Dilog disk controller
with a Seagate ST251 attached.
The machine is currently running DSM-11 and recognises the drive as a RA81.
I hope to produce a list relating the Dilog part numbers to original DEC
part numbers.
It was/is common for controller cards to call anything over ~150mb
an 'ra81' just to give the software a diskid it knew about.
On the various Dilog cards you should find (either on the spine/handles
or the card's front/back) a name. Something like "DQ696" (a disk
controller) or "DQ132" (tape controller). If you can find any numbers
at all let us know and we can probably id them for you.
Steven Schultz
sms(a)moe.2bsd.com
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