Re: [pups] 2.11BSD boot hangs.

On 26 Feb, Steven M. Schultz wrote: ;-) ... like setup.ps says. Yes. All the devices where used in a MVII bevore and are knowen to work. Thats a bit confusing. BINGO! Pulling W5 solved the problem. But then I seted it again to double check. (I changed location today and took only the cards and disk with me.) In the "new" BA23 the system runs even with the W5 jumper installed. Then I noticed the different setting of the front panel DIP swich. The upper switch is off and the lower on. The switches of the other cabinet are both on. If I boot the machine with W5 installed and the upper switch on it hangs. It continues to run immediately if it is switched off. What is the purpose of this switches? OK. The machine is currently un-tar-ing /usr... :-))) Ahh, and an other question: Can the RT11 bootstrap listed in http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/bootstr… be used to boot 2.11BSD? I have no bootstrap ROM card. (Emanuel, hint, hint. ;-) ) So I use a minicom script to load the bootstrap via ODT. But the current bootstrap script is for TMSCP. So I have to load the bootblocks from tape... -- tschüß, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA54909 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:48:15 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au (psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au [129.78.83.26]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA54905 for <PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:48:12 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from johnh(a)psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au) Received: (from johnh@localhost) by psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id IAA24139 for PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:44:23 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:44:23 +1100 (EST) From: John Holden <johnh(a)psych.usyd.edu.au> Message-Id: <200102262144.IAA24139(a)psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au> To: PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Subject: Re: [pups] Swap device in V6? Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk The root device, swap device, swap size and offset are hard coded into the kernel configuration file c.c. This is build by 'myconf', although a lot of people would directly edit l.s and c.c (in /usr/sys/conf). There are no magic /dev/swap entries. Edition 7 does the same thing. For a RK05 disk, the filesystem would typically occupy 4000 blocks, with the last 872 being allocated for swap. If you built a new root disk, you had to be careful that the disk size you gave to 'mkfs', didn't overlap the hard configured swap disk. No disk partitions. You can find out the current values by using one of the debuggers (db or cdb) to find the values of swap (_swapdev), swap size (_nswap), swap offset (_swplo) and root device (_rootdev). You can also use 'nm' to get the symbol table, and 'od' the kernel file /unix. The RK05 was usually the first entry in the device switch tables, so the major/minor numbers are usually 0. The 'ps' command looks up the symbol table of the unix kernel, and gets the device entry for swap (_swapdev), and the process table (_proc) It would open /dev as file, and read the directory entries to find a matching device entry, so it then had the name of a device to open (you cannot open a device based only in the major and minor device entries from a user process). It also uses /dev to decode tty entries into names. For 'ps' to work correctly, /unix had to be linked to the real kernel, say rkunix. Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA55090 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:32:10 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from henry.cs.adfa.edu.au (henry.cs.adfa.edu.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA55086 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:32:08 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: (from wkt@localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.11.2/8.9.3) id f1QMZJR09631; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:35:19 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from wkt) From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.edu.au> Message-Id: <200102262235.f1QMZJR09631(a)henry.cs.adfa.edu.au> Subject: Re: [pups] Announce: The Unix Tree In-Reply-To: <200102261747.SAA16216(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> from "jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de" at "Feb 26, 2001 06:47:11 pm" To: jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:32:38 +1100 (EST) CC: PDP-11 Unix Preservation Society <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au> Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.edu.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL68 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk In article by jkunz(a)unixag-kl.fh-kl.de: They are not real passwords, in a sense. There is only a userpool of 1,000 usernames/passwords. When you register for access into the Unix Archive, you get one out of the pool. The only purpose here is to prove to SCO that you indeed agreed to their on-line license before you were given access to the archive. I'd be quite happy to completely dispense with the passwords altogether and run an anonymous service. If/when Caldera work out what they are doing with this stuff, I'll push them to allow for anonymous access. Cheers, Warren Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA55130 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:39:18 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from moe.2bsd.com (MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA55126 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:39:14 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from sms(a)moe.2bsd.com) Received: (from sms@localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) id f1QMQOv11403 for pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 14:26:24 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 14:26:24 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" <sms(a)moe.2bsd.com> Message-Id: <200102262226.f1QMQOv11403(a)moe.2bsd.com> To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Subject: Re: [pups] 2.11BSD boot hangs. Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk Hi - Years ago I was completely suprised that 'halt' in kernel mode did not work and the system simply continued executing the next instruction. I suspect that one of the switches enables the line frequency clock. With out a clock running things will work (at least minimally) as long as there are some interrupts happening. I vaguely remember that some systems (11/23?) had an externally enabled clock and if that switch was not set correctly the OS could be installed but the system would "hang" later on due to no context switch scheduling. Fantastic! I think it will work. 2.11 is expecting the registers to contain the following: R0 = unit number R1 = CSR of booting controller as long as those are set it should not matter what bootcode is used. Steven Schultz sms(a)moe.2bsd.com Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA55189 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:46:55 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from fgh.geac.com.au ([203.32.189.100]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA55185 for <PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:46:53 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from dave(a)horsfall.org) Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by fgh.geac.com.au (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f1QMdUY03244; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:39:30 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:39:30 +1100 (EST) From: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)horsfall.org> X-X-Sender: <dave(a)fgh.au.geac.com> To: Ken Wellsch <kwellsch(a)tampabay.rr.com> cc: Roger Ivie <IVIE(a)cc.usu.edu>, <PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au> Subject: Re: [pups] Swap device in V6? In-Reply-To: <3A9A97B5.4EBD13A4(a)tampabay.rr.com> Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.32.0102270938530.2716-100000(a)fgh.au.geac.com> X-No-Archive: Yes X-Disclaimer: "Me, speak for us?" X-Witty-Saying: "Mobius Strip - See other side for instructions" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Ken Wellsch wrote: As I dimly recall, you need to link "/dev/drum" to whichever is the swap device. -- Dave Horsfall CL VK2KFU dave(a)geac.com.au Ph: +61 2 9978-7493 Fx: * 9978-7490 Geac Computers P/L (ERP Division) 2/57 Christie St, St Leonards 2065, Australia Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA55240 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:52:59 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from fgh.geac.com.au ([203.32.189.100]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA55235 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:52:57 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from dave(a)horsfall.org) Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by fgh.geac.com.au (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f1QMjuC03306 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:45:56 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:45:56 +1100 (EST) From: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)fgh.geac.com.au> X-X-Sender: <dave(a)fgh.au.geac.com> To: PDP Unix Preservation Society <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au> Subject: Re: [pups] Swap device in V6? In-Reply-To: <01K0KD39CMMQ91Z5ER(a)cc.usu.edu> Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.32.0102270942470.2716-100000(a)fgh.au.geac.com> X-No-Archive: Yes X-Disclaimer: "Me, speak for us?" X-Witty-Saying: "Mobius Strip - See other side for instructions" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Roger Ivie wrote: Yes, that's how it was done, leading to the dreaded "panic: swap". I think the swapped image became the parent, and the in-core one the child, hence the child was pretty well guaranteed to run before the parent (it typically did an exec() afterwards). -- Dave Horsfall CL VK2KFU dave(a)geac.com.au Ph: +61 2 9978-7493 Fx: * 9978-7490 Geac Computers P/L (ERP Division) 2/57 Christie St, St Leonards 2065, Australia Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA55279 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:55:22 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from arundel.fortyfour.org (138bus2.tampabay.rr.com [24.94.138.2]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA55275 for <PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:55:18 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from kwellsch(a)tampabay.rr.com) Received: from tampabay.rr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arundel.fortyfour.org (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f1QMpBL28517; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:51:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3A9ADDDF.F8468078(a)tampabay.rr.com> Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:51:11 -0500 From: Ken Wellsch <kwellsch(a)tampabay.rr.com> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.0.38 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)horsfall.org> CC: PUPS(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Subject: Re: [pups] Swap device in V6? References: <Pine.GSO.4.32.0102270938530.2716-100000(a)fgh.au.geac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk Dave Horsfall wrote: After some wise person earlier explained the whole process in detail, once I'd seen the final step ,I realized my error - I was booting rkunix and as it turned out, had not matched /unix with that kernel... I just tried it now and 'ps' is a happy camper. B^) -- Ken Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA55384 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:15:29 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from fgh.geac.com.au ([203.32.189.100]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA55380 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:15:27 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from dave(a)horsfall.org) Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by fgh.geac.com.au (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f1QMe9n03256 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:40:10 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:40:09 +1100 (EST) From: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)fgh.geac.com.au> X-X-Sender: <dave(a)fgh.au.geac.com> To: PDP Unix Preservation Society <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au> Subject: Re: [pups] Swap device in V6? Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.32.0102270939440.2716-100000(a)fgh.au.geac.com> X-No-Archive: Yes X-Disclaimer: "Me, speak for us?" X-Witty-Saying: "Mobius Strip - See other side for instructions" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Ken Wellsch wrote: As I dimly recall, you need to link "/dev/drum" to whichever is the swap device. -- Dave Horsfall CL VK2KFU dave(a)geac.com.au Ph: +61 2 9978-7493 Fx: * 9978-7490 Geac Computers P/L (ERP Division) 2/57 Christie St, St Leonards 2065, Australia Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA55398 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:15:57 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au (psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au [129.78.83.26]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA55394 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:15:55 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from johnh(a)psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au) Received: (from johnh@localhost) by psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id KAA26058 for pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:12:07 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:12:07 +1100 (EST) From: John Holden <johnh(a)psych.usyd.edu.au> Message-Id: <200102262312.KAA26058(a)psychwarp.psych.usyd.edu.au> To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Subject: [pups] Forks under V6 Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk No. Fork calls the internal version 'newproc'. It tries to allocate memory from the core map for the new process, and only when it fails that it creates the new process as a swap image. Effectively, it copies out the parent as a swap image, but attaches it to the child process (the parent isn't really swapped). In 'miniunix', the V6 strip down for pdp-11's without memory management (pdp11/20, 05, 10 and 40's without the proper options), only a single process would fit in core, so every context switch or fork required swapping. I cannot speak for pre V6 Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA55548 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:50:56 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au) Received: from Tempo.Update.UU.SE (IDENT:0@Tempo.Update.UU.SE [130.238.19.17]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA55544 for <pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:50:51 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from bqt(a)update.uu.se) Received: from localhost (bqt@localhost) by Tempo.Update.UU.SE (8.11.2/8.11.2/Update-Iltempogigante) with ESMTP id f1QNkkx08605; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:46:46 +0100 Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:46:45 +0100 (CET) From: Johnny Billquist <bqt(a)update.uu.se> To: "Steven M. Schultz" <sms(a)moe.2bsd.com> cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Subject: Re: [pups] 2.11BSD boot hangs. In-Reply-To: <200102262226.f1QMQOv11403(a)moe.2bsd.com> Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0102270042590.7228-100000(a)Tempo.Update.UU.SE> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Steven M. Schultz wrote: Could be. I also remember seeing somewhere that the two dip switches on the front panel of BA23 boxes should be set differently for PDP-11s and VAXen. Appearantly they expect the boot button to behave in different ways on the bus as well... (and HALT I think) Don't have that docuemnt anywhere close though... That definitely happens for RSX atleast. You *must* have a clock interrupt running, or you are cooked. Then it's more forgiving than the RSX boot code. I have tried that bootstrap and it won't boot RSX atleast, that much I know... Speaking of which; does anyone have boot roms for TMSCP for the M9312? Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt(a)update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA55592 for pups-liszt; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:53:39 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au)