On 17-Nov-07, at 4:15 PM, Bob Eager wrote:
> ** Reply to note from Toby Thain <toby(a)smartgames.ca> Sat, 17 Nov
> 2007 12:44:53 -0200
>
>> On 17-Nov-07, at 11:21 AM, Bob Eager wrote:
>>
>>> ** Reply to note from Toby Thain <toby(a)smartgames.ca> Sat, 17 Nov
>>> 2007 11:08:32 -0200
>>>
>>>> On 2-Nov-07, at 11:59 AM, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>>> ** Reply to note from Brantley Coile <brantley(a)coraid.com> Fri, 2
>>>>> Nov 2007 09:42:47 -0400
>>>>>> Wes,
>>>>>> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/
>>>>>> index.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Probably was!
>>>>>
>>>>> I just bought a copy on eBay a couple of weeks ago, and have just
>>>>> read it
>>>>> cover to cover.
>>>>
>>>> There's more than one edition. ...
> I have the earlier "Computer Engineering" and the 2nd edition of
> "Art of
> Digital Design". I have now ordered the 1998 edition of "Computer
> Engineering". I look forward to all of the stuff that was too late
> for the
> first edition.
Bob,
Sorry! I think I was actually talking about a different Bell title. I
checked my past orders and found the following:
Author: Bell, C. Gordon; Newell, Allen
Title: Computer Structures: Readings and Examples
Author: Siewiorek, Daniel; Bell, C. Gordon; Newell, Allen,
Title: Computer Structures: Principles and Examples
Both of these contain many architectural case studies (each book
covers a different set). And both should be findable in this list:
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?
an=bell&sts=t&tn=computer+structures
I also have Computer Engineering but it's a different book! Sorry
again about the confusion.
--Toby
>
>
> Bob
** Reply to note from Brantley Coile <brantley(a)coraid.com> Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:42:47 -0400
> Wes,
> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>
> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/index.html
Probably was!
I just bought a copy on eBay a couple of weeks ago, and have just read it
cover to cover. A bit dry at the start, but fascinating...I starting using
PDP11s back in 1972. (an 11/20)
And used what I think was the first v6 UNIX system in England...
Bob
cc: pups(a)minnie.tuhs.org
Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why. I can't
pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
racks are out). I'm not interested in emulators. It looks to me
like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
So I guess I have two questions:
Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
etc? I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
cases so they were a bit, well, big). I don't want to spend my life
trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
to pay. I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
get that way.
Thanks
--tim
I know, this is completley off the wall, and odd at best. But are
there any surviving copies of v6, that ran on the 370? I understand
there were several ports, one running on UTS, another on bare metal
before AIX was ported...
Did any of these survive?
Bad luck. The CD's are lost (unreadable actually). Not surprising seeing as they
were old and had been tossed around so many times (sic).
Maybe the original request for Mach sources should be redirected to comp.os.mach
or to some of the original authors to see if they still keep something around.
It might be that even CMU keeps something.
j
> I *think* I have.
>
> Thank goodness yo mention this! I believe I have copies on CD-ROM dating back
> from '94 or so. I'll dig them up. The problem is I believed I also had them on
> the FTP server, but they aren't. I must have lost them on one disk crash or
> another and didn't notice, so your question is great for I might part of the
> original CDs and lose it.
>
> 'nuff said. I'll check this afternoon when I go back home and try to find again
> those old CDs (cross your fingers).
--
These opinions are mine and only mine. Hey man, I saw them first!
José R. Valverde
De nada sirve la Inteligencia Artificial cuando falta la Natural
>
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:39:58 -0600
> From: "Brad Midgley" <bmidgley(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: [pups] pdp11 in Utah
> To: pups(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Message-ID:
> <d89ddf300710311039q134e47b4q5f515efb22860d43(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi
>
> I have a pdp11 (about the size of a 6u rackmount) free if anyone is
> interested.
This sounds like a Digital BA-11 of some sort. It could be something
as early as a pdp 11/20, 11/05, 11/34, 11/35, or as late as a 11/24
or 11/44 -- possibly others.
>
> --
> Brad
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:44:50 -0400
> From: "Gregg Levine" <gregg.drwho8(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pups] pdp11 in Utah
> To: "Brad Midgley" <bmidgley(a)gmail.com>
> Cc: pups(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Message-ID:
> <18d205ed0710311344g13a53c8bo9fbdd03b73ef4ae1(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 10/31/07, Brad Midgley <bmidgley(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> I have a pdp11 (about the size of a 6u rackmount) free if anyone
>> is interested.
>>
>> --
>> Brad
>> _______________________________________________
>> PUPS mailing list
>> PUPS(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
>>
> Hello!
> Brad, I am interested, although the space in my apartment would be the
> big issue. The problem is that I am in an apartment in NYC, Queens to
> be exact. Just how hard would it be to send it to me?
Not easy or cheap. It's bulky, heavy and would usually require 2
persons to move around. I've moved various of my pdp11s around and
it's always been hard work. Stashing a case of beer in the bottom of
an H960 is good incentive for assistants.
> If its both cost
> and space excessive then perhaps others on the list would be
> interested.
>
> Oh and which model is this fellow? I am looking for a PDP-11/53, and
> have been for many years.
e-Bay?
> --
> Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8(a)gmail.com
> "This signature was once found posting rude
> messages in English in the Moscow subway."
[snip]
--
Milo Velimirović, Unix Computer Network Administrator
608-785-6618 Office - 608-386-2817 Cell
University of Wisconsin - La Crosse
La Crosse, Wisconsin 54601 USA 43 48 48 N 91 13 53 W
--
There's a reason Dennis Ritchie and Ken Thompson have been awarded
the U.S. National Medal of Technology (1998) and are fellows of the
Computer History Museum Online. Dave Cutler hasn't and isn't.
"You are not expected to understand this."
Hi All,
That's a BA23 in tower stand, aka a room heater.
The system looks like a Micro-PDP11/23 or /53.
The tape unit seems to be an old model TK50 (it
has no markings, which was standard for the old
units), the disk could be an RD-53, it has the
same alu frame. Other disks (RD54) are full-metal,
or smaller (RD31, 32, 20).
The buttons on the front panel seem to be just 4,
not 6. The original Micro-11 (aka 11/23) had 4,
because it could handle only a single disk (the
10MB disk RD50); the newer systems had two extra
buttons (online and WP) for a second disk.
So... looks like a Micro-11[/23] with larger than
standard disk (RD53)and the original TK50 tape.
On the back panel we only see the bulkhead for the
system-standard DZV-11 4-port async module, of
which ports 0 and 1 (console and aux, resp) are
in semi-fixed mode.
Cheers,
Fred
PS: for people in NL; I have a few 11/53 systems
left... :)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
> To: "Al Kossow" <aek(a)bitsavers.org>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:22:33 +0100
>
>
> Tue, Oct 30, 2007 at 04:26:14PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
>
> > > Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
> > Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
> > I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>
> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
> connected to an old soundcard like Spectrum or other similars,
> having some cdrom interfaces.
>
> sorry for my bad english :)
>
>
Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
for me.
Hi,
I have the same problem with an old floppy disk (2,5). Any Ideas what I
can do?
Thanks a lot and kid regards,
Christopher
On Thu, 1 Nov 2007, tuhs-request(a)minnie.tuhs.org wrote:
> Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 12:00:01 +1000
> From: tuhs-request(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Reply-To: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> To: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Subject: TUHS Digest, Vol 43, Issue 1
>
> Send TUHS mailing list submissions to
> tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> tuhs-request(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> tuhs-owner(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of TUHS digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (asbesto)
> 2. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (James Petts)
> 3. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (asbesto)
> 4. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (Warner Losh)
> 5. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (Angus Robinson)
> 6. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (Wilko Bulte)
> 7. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (James Petts)
> 8. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (asbesto)
> 9. Re: Recovering flaky CDs (Wilko Bulte)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:22:33 +0100
> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> To: Al Kossow <aek(a)bitsavers.org>
> Cc: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Message-ID: <20071031092233.GC14989(a)freaknet.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15
>
> Tue, Oct 30, 2007 at 04:26:14PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
>
>>> Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
>> Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
>> I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>
> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
> connected to an old soundcard like Spectrum or other similars,
> having some cdrom interfaces.
>
> sorry for my bad english :)
>
>
>
>
> --
> [ 73 de IW9HGS : freaknet medialab : radiocybernet : poetry hacklab]
> [ http://freaknet.org/asbesto - http://papuasia.org/radiocybernet ]
> [ NON SCRIVERMI USANDO LETTERE ACCENTATE! - NON MANDARMI ALLEGATI ]
> [ *I DELETE* EMAIL > 100K, ATTACHMENTS, HTML, M$-WORD DOC and SPAM ]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:25:00 -0800
> From: "James Petts" <jpetts(a)operamail.com>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> To: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
> Cc: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Message-ID: <20071031162500.832803AA648(a)ws5-8.us4.outblaze.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
>> To: "Al Kossow" <aek(a)bitsavers.org>
>> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
>> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:22:33 +0100
>>
>>
>> Tue, Oct 30, 2007 at 04:26:14PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
>>
>>>> Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
>>> Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
>>> I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>>
>> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
>> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
>> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
>> connected to an old soundcard like Spectrum or other similars,
>> having some cdrom interfaces.
>>
>> sorry for my bad english :)
>>
>>
>
> Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
> resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
> for me.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 17:47:36 +0100
> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> To: James Petts <jpetts(a)operamail.com>
> Cc: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org
> Message-ID: <20071031164736.GB22786(a)freaknet.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15
>
> Wed, Oct 31, 2007 at 08:25:00AM -0800, James Petts wrote:
>
>>>>> Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
>>>> Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
>>>> I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>>> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
>>> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
>>> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
>> Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
>> resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
>> for me.
>
> A great problem I had some time ago was a sort of oxydation of the
> cd material; this seem to happen using very bad cd brands. i had
> this horrible problems with "SEANTRAM" and "PRINCO" cd's; the
> princo cd was literally unreadable after only 6 months of age!
>
>
> --
> [ 73 de IW9HGS : freaknet medialab : radiocybernet : poetry hacklab]
> [ http://freaknet.org/asbesto - http://papuasia.org/radiocybernet ]
> [ NON SCRIVERMI USANDO LETTERE ACCENTATE! - NON MANDARMI ALLEGATI ]
> [ *I DELETE* EMAIL > 100K, ATTACHMENTS, HTML, M$-WORD DOC and SPAM ]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:56:29 -0600 (MDT)
> From: Warner Losh <imp(a)bsdimp.com>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> To: jpetts(a)operamail.com
> Cc: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org, asbesto(a)freaknet.org
> Message-ID: <20071031.105629.104123720.imp(a)bsdimp.com>
> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> From: "James Petts" <jpetts(a)operamail.com>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:25:00 -0800
>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
>>> To: "Al Kossow" <aek(a)bitsavers.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
>>> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:22:33 +0100
>>>
>>>
>>> Tue, Oct 30, 2007 at 04:26:14PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
>>>> Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
>>>> I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>>>
>>> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
>>> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
>>> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
>>> connected to an old soundcard like Spectrum or other similars,
>>> having some cdrom interfaces.
>>>
>>> sorry for my bad english :)
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
>> resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
>> for me.
>
> I've used cdparanoia to recover badly damaged audio disks. Are there
> not similar programs for data disks?
>
> Warner
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 19:15:09 +0200
> From: Angus Robinson <angus(a)fairhaven.za.net>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> To: Warner Losh <imp(a)bsdimp.com>
> Cc: tuhs(a)minnie.tuhs.org, asbesto(a)freaknet.org
> Message-ID: <4728B81D.40304(a)fairhaven.za.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
>
> Warner Losh wrote:
>> From: "James Petts" <jpetts(a)operamail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
>> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:25:00 -0800
>>
>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
>>>> To: "Al Kossow" <aek(a)bitsavers.org>
>>>> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
>>>> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:22:33 +0100
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Tue, Oct 30, 2007 at 04:26:14PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of recovering flaky CDs?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Easiest first step is try using different kinds of CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
>>>>> I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
>>>>>
>>>> I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
>>>> damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
>>>> own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
>>>> connected to an old soundcard like Spectrum or other similars,
>>>> having some cdrom interfaces.
>>>>
>>>> sorry for my bad english :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
>>> resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
>>> for me.
>>>
>>
>> I've used cdparanoia to recover badly damaged audio disks. Are there
>> not similar programs for data disks?
>>
>> Warner
>>
>
> Dont know how true it is but the local paper here was running a story
> about some students using goverment condoms to fix scratched cd's. They
> worked for 3 uses. Never tried it as most of the stuff i have on cd i
> can get again.
>
> Regards,
> Angus
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TUHS mailing list
>> TUHS(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
>>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Wilko Bulte" <wb(a)freebie.xs4all.nl>
> To: asbesto <asbesto(a)freaknet.org>
> Subject: Re: [TUHS] Recovering flaky CDs
> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 19:09:11 +0100
>
>
> Quoting asbesto, who wrote on Wed, Oct 31, 2007 at 05:47:36PM +0100 ..
> > Wed, Oct 31, 2007 at 08:25:00AM -0800, James Petts wrote:
> >
> > > > > > Is there anybody on this list who knows a way of
> > recovering flaky CDs?
> > > > > Easiest first step is try using different kinds of
> > CD/CD-R/DVD-R drives.
> > > > > I have found some 'unreadable' CDs could be read using a DVD drive.
> > > > I remember a very old SONY cd-rom reader capable of reading very
> > > > damaged cd! It was the SONY CDU-33A, it has his
> > > > own controller, so was not an IDE or SCSI drive. But it can be
> > > Those CD Doctor "cleaners" (they actually do a minor
> > > resurfacing of the disc) have rescued several discs
> > > for me.
> >
> > A great problem I had some time ago was a sort of oxydation of the
> > cd material; this seem to happen using very bad cd brands. i had
>
> Note that the reflecting layer in factory produced CDs is aluminium.
> A thin layer of lacquer is protecting the reflector.
>
> As an interesting eye opening experiment I dumped one of these AOL promo CDs
> we used to be bombarded with in a bowl of lukewarm water. Plain water, 25
> degrC. Within a day the aluminium layer had holes in it the size of dimes.
> Apparantly the protective lacquer was very substandard.
>
> El-cheapo CDR can have similar characteristics.
And it is the top side (label side) of the CD that is most
fragile, not the reading side. There is about 0.5 mm of
plastic that can take some pretty fearsome scratches and
still be readable, or at least resurfaceable (is that a
word?).
I emailed Jim Gettys on ancient X Window System code and this is his reply.
(I asked him if it was okay to pass this on to the TUHS list, and he said
yes.)
He's after someone who knows ClearCase, so if there's anyone on this list
who's knowledgable, or knows someone else who's knowledgeable, feel free to
get in touch with him.
Thanks
Wesley Parish
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
Subject: Re: X Windows preX10R3 releases
Date: Wednesday 17 October 2007 01:53
From: Jim Gettys <jg at laptop dot org>
To: Wesley Parish <wes.parish at paradise dot net dot nz>
Yup. I have bits back to the very beginning of X, and slightly
before.... I have snapshots of our RCS pool back into 1984 or so;
unfortunately, I did not copy the RCS pool itself which would have every
commit.
I also have copies of the X Consortium backups; in there are ClearCase
databases which the RCS pool was imported into, and may have the commit
by commit history back to the beginning for many files; but it will take
someone with ClearCase expertise to retrieve things from that.
I've been meaning to do something with these for the last couple years,
but have been too busy with OLPC to follow up.
Regards,
- Jim Gettys
On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 21:19 +1300, Wesley Parish wrote:
> Hi. I'm a part of TUHS, The (amorphous ;) Unix Heritage Society, and was
> wondering on the mail list about the X Window System releases prior to
> X11Rx, in relation to a Groklaw article on Yet Another Stupid Lawsuit aimed
> at Red Hat and Novell:
> http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20071011205044141
> referencing some basic aspects of X Window architecture. I was referred to
> google, and the presence of the X10R[3 4] which apparently were the first
> public release.
>
> I then wondered about the existence of the releases even earlier than
> X10R3, and Paul Jones, formerly of the DEC Systems Research Center, advised
> me to contact you in relation to this. He also says to say "Hi".
>
> Thanks for any help you can give on this question.
>
> Wesley Parish
--
Jim Gettys
One Laptop Per Child
-------------------------------------------------------
--
Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
-----
Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are
impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla
warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
of the foolish.
-----
Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
You ask, what is the most important thing?
Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
Is any such creature available? X11 is >10 years old; apparently the last X10
release was in 1986.
Does that source code exist anywhere now? Or has it vanished into the Great
Bit-Bucket in the Sky?
Thansk
Wesley Parish
--
Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
-----
Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are
impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla
warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
of the foolish.
-----
Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
You ask, what is the most important thing?
Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
>
>> I have X10R3 and X10R4 archives.
>> I have found it somewhere in google some years ago, I do not remember
>> now where, probably MIT or so. If it is allowed to upload it I can
>> upload it to TUHS.
>> But perhaps they are still available .
>>
>
> I've just run through a quite search of X[1 10]R[1 3] and X10R[3 4] seems to
> be the only members of that vintage. One fragment on google said that that
> was because it was the first example of the code to be released outside of
> MIT.
>
Have you tried contacting Jim Gettys? His home page
(http://www.handhelds.org/People/jg.html) says: "jg" can be sent mail at
freedesktop dot org.
Paul
Good news!
Yesterday I connected again to QNX.com (as I usually do every two or
three months) to see whether there was any new release when I found out that
it is now released with a "mixed" license, being free for academic and
non-commercial use, and -here's the interesting bit- it now includes the
full source code to the operating system (microkernel, real time, SMP support,
etc...) and comes with a perpetual license (for academic, non-commercial use).
You can download the full sources, recompile and modify it and browse
the subversion repository online. It has some restrictions of course. It's
great as QNX is one of the traditional non-ATT derived UNIX and has been
considered the best Real Time operating system for ages.
So, while it may not be possible to include the sources in TUHS yet,
at least it might be worth having some links on the TUHS site to Sun's
Opensolaris and QNX sites so people may know where to get the sources for
them. It may seem 'moot' from a 'heritage' point of view now, but it may
pay off later if some one keeps private copies of these sources for the
record. Who knows how long will the current trend last?
And may be we can contact them and ask for permission to include
a copy of the tree on the archive (they leave the door open to that) just
for historical purposes (with all due disclaimers and acknowledgements).
See
http://www.qnx.com
j
--
These opinions are mine and only mine. Hey man, I saw them first!
José R. Valverde
De nada sirve la Inteligencia Artificial cuando falta la Natural
groklaw has some details about Yet Another SCO-Group-ism:
http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20071011205044141
that appears to be about windowing systems.
I'm wondering, would Sun's NeWS be of any value or interest in this situation?
And if so, does anyone have suitably detailed SDKs, DDKs, whathaveyou, of
NeWS? (It would be nice if Sun would release it plus source code to TuHS
under a suitable license ... but though dreams are free, they don't fill the
belly ;)
Wesley Parish
--
Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
-----
Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are
impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla
warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
of the foolish.
-----
Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
You ask, what is the most important thing?
Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
I don't know if anyone would be interested in this...
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=204974&package_id=245…
I've hacked up a copy of simh to include slirp (usermode networking from
qemu), and packed up a copy of 4.3RENO.
It should be pretty easy for Windows users to just install & hit the "run
4.3BSD-RENO" icon...
The download is just under 90 megabytes, and I've included nearly 80 pdf's..
Unfortunatly not all of the converted cleanly..
At any rate I'm sure the base install needs more tweaking, and I should load
more software onto the /usr/local drive (which I've made a seperate disk to
allow for easy updating..)
As always feel free to download & give it a test. At the least it should be
a painfee install & run.
Jason
I was wondering with 32v being released, does anyone have all the mach
source?
As you probably know CMU released 3.0, but I was wondering about 1.0 & 2.0.
Additionally does anyone have NeXTSTEP source? I've read that they did make
it available to universities, I'd just hate to see it die... Or even old
copies of Darwin, which seem to have dissapeared from Apple (or I'm just
searching wrong)...
Thanks!
A new port of UNIX Version 7 to the x86 (IA-32) based PC is now
available. The port, called V7/x86, was originally done around
1999: "as something to do with the UNIX source code", when the $100
source licences first became available. Over the last year or so,
I've been working intermittently at preparing it for release.
In classic porting style, the port includes a 16- and 32-bit
UNIX-style x86 assembler written from scratch, though the next step
of conjuring pcc to emit 32-bit x86 code was not done. Originally,
the system used the TenDRA C compiler, but TenDRA is huge and this
was never a good match. (Without demand paging, and with restrictions
on the size of the buffer cache, there is a definite limit to how
big you want much-used binaries to be.) However, since the Amsterdam
Compiler Kit was released as open source, the ACK K&R compiler,
with a backend revised to speak "as" rather than "ACK assembler",
works very well.
V7/x86 currently supports ATA (IDE) hard drives, ATAPI CD drives,
a 1.44M floppy drive, and standard serial ports, in addition to the
usual PC screen and keyboard. For easier installation and setup,
supplied utilities allow access to CD (ISO 9660) and FAT (MS-DOS)
filesystems. Boot code uses the PC BIOS. At present, there is no
SCSI support.
Overall, the system is stable and quite generally usable. For
instance, it is an easy-ish task to build the V7/x86 distribution
on V7 itself, including packaging it as a small CDROM image. When
using the C shell, together with contemporary versions of vi and
more, one even tends to forget this is V7. (Given the absence of
X and TCP/IP, the overall "feel" of the system is something like
an early SCO System V release: though possibly not so unreliable.)
The port was originally done more for the sheer pleasure of getting
to grips with the V7 source code than for any good reason. But
I've since spent a bit of effort trying to put together a fairly
usable release -- though there will be plenty of rough edges -- in
the hope that, for instance, some school or college might eventually
take the thing up as a vehicle for students to get practical
experience on. After all, it really is possible to write (say) a
device driver from scratch and get it working in the course of only
one or two evenings. Of course, the PDP-11 original can be (and I
hope still is) used for that purpose, but presumably PC architecture,
and devices, and assembly language, would all be part of a modern
curriculum, anyway, leaving fewer layers of obscurity for the
student.
Anyway, if any of you would like to take a look at the thing (even
if only to point out some of the more egregious of the remaining
errors) the link is
http://www.nordier.com/v7x86/
Apart from actually installing the system on some suitable PC, it
is also possible to boot from the CDROM or floppy image and then
simply quit out of the install utility to the shell prompt.
Alternatively, the system can be fairly readily run under Bochs or
some other emulator, using the available "demo" image.
There is a short user-oriented introductory document, with examples,
here
http://www.nordier.com/v7x86/doc/v7x86intro.pdf
What is presently lacking is a document containing a more technical
description of the port, but I hope this will be available before
too long.
As far as the web pages are concerned, these were originally set
up before the 10 August 2007 Judge Kimball ruling in favour of
Novell. No changes have been made (to copyright notices, licence
information, etc.) in the light of that ruling, though of course I
will willingly make changes if and when I know what they should be.
Incidentally, there's been mention, here, in the past, of one or
two projects to port V7 or 32V to the PC. For all I know, these
may still be ongoing: V7/x86 is an unrelated effort.
--
Robert Nordier
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Nordier & Associates rnordier(a)nordier.com Telephone: +27 31 261-4895
PO Box 11266, Marine Parade, 4056, South Africa Mobile : +27 72 265-2390
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
> Awesome work. I notice that you require at least a 486 to run this
> though. Is there any technical reason, or could this be moved to a 386
> by means of a simple recompile? Also, how 32-bit IS the port? Would it
> be hard to build a 286 version or even 8086/8088 version to give a
> real OS to the old XT/AT in the basement?
No offense intended, but why waste time on 386 (or even way more time on
286)? I can't imagine that anyone has any of those machines anymore.
And if anyone is so broke that they do and can't afford a newer machine
I have piles of celeron boxes looking for a home. 300-500mhz with 64-128M
and probably a broken disk but maybe it works. You pay shipping and they
are yours. If you are doing interesting work and you are really broke
I'll pay shipping.
But 286? Come on. Let it go, it sucked. I can almost see the point of
386 except that nobody has one.
--
---
Larry McVoy lm at bitmover.comhttp://www.bitkeeper.com
> From: "Michael Kerpan" <madcrow.maxwell(a)gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 14:44:27 -0400
>
> Awesome work. I notice that you require at least a 486 to run this
> though. Is there any technical reason, or could this be moved to a 386
> by means of a simple recompile? Also, how 32-bit IS the port? Would it
> be hard to build a 286 version or even 8086/8088 version to give a
> real OS to the old XT/AT in the basement?
8086 lacks the required protected mode. don't remember how xenix over
came this problem when it was first released. no one even has to think
about this problem today
I've placed two sets of 800bpi 780 System III tape images
temporarily under http://bitsavers.org/sysIII
Curiously, they don't match. There were no dates on the tapes
which are originals.
Al Kossow wrote:
>I've placed two sets of 800bpi 780 System III tape images
>temporarily under http://bitsavers.org/sysIII
>
>Curiously, they don't match. There were no dates on the tapes
>which are originals.
>
>_______________________________________________
>TUHS mailing list
>TUHS(a)minnie.tuhs.org
>https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
>
>
>
>
Why do I get read errors on the second file on the first tapes of both
sets under SIMH? I didn't think it was even possible for tape I/O errors
to occur under SIMH unless the image is corrupted.
