TUHS

tuhs@tuhs.org

60 participants
6509 discussions

by Clem Cole

As I told Phil off-line, I wold ask around the DEC Unix alumni and see what I could find out. On Mon, Oct 22, 2012 at 5:02 PM, Richard Schedler wrote: > Before leaving HP Labs, I moved the Gatekeeper Archives over to > apotheca.hpl.hp.com . I just checked and was pleasantly surprised to see > that they're still around. > > --Richard > HP Labs FTP Server This is the FTP server for Hewlett-Packard Laboratories. It replaces the following servers: - ftp.hpl.hp.com - gatekeeper.hpl.hp.com - gatekeeper.research.compaq.com - gatekeeper.dec.com This system is not for file storage nor any other use without express authorization from the Hewlett-Packard Company. All logins and file transfers on this system are logged and monitored. Please use the feedback link below to report problems or ask questions. *Repository Services* - *Access the repository via FTP* <ftp://apotheca.hpl.hp.com/> - *Access the repository via HTTP* <http://apotheca.hpl.hp.com/ftp/> *Other Information* - *What happened to gatekeeper.dec.com?*<http://apotheca.hpl.hp.com/what-happened-to-gatekeeper.html>

12 years, 7 months

Bryan Cantrill on bfs & ta

by Sevan / Venture37

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rk8aZv0JJuk&feature=player_detailpage#t=3493s "SunOS has never run on a 16bit machine" My response was M68000 & 386 but his counter response was they both supported 32bit addressing. Sevan

12 years, 7 months

off-topic: retrocomputing: HP Laserjet 6MP question

by Aharon Robbins

Hello All. This is a bit off topic, but I figure people on this list may have the experience and also the knowledge I need... I have an HP Laserjet 6MP printer; it is 16 years old but still going strong. It has a level 2 Adobe Postscript interpreter and a whopping 3 Megs of memory. It is attached to an ethernet-to-parallel port thingy that lets me spool to it over the network; I am printing from Linux systems running CUPS. Here's the problem: No matter how I have the printer settings set for the paper source, when I use tiff2ps to convert a TIFF file into PostScript: 1. If I use the 'make level 2 postcript' option to tiff2ps, I get a much smaller file, but the printer decides it wants paper to come from the manual feed paper tray. The problem is that this paper tray usually doesn't have paper in it, so I have to go to the basement and put paper in. 2. OTOH, if I use the default which makes level 1 postscript, I get a file that is 10 times bigger, but the printer then decides it will take paper from the tray, like it's supposed to. I keep the postscript file around for easy reprinting. I don't care for big files, and they take longer to send, too. Googling has not helped. If anyone knows what kind of magic string to add to the generated level 2 postscript to make it choose a paper source, or has any other ideas, I would love to hear from you. Thanks! Arnold Robbins

12 years, 7 months

gatekeeper mirror?

by A. P. Garcia

Hi, Does anyone have a mirror of the old ftp site gatekeeper.dec.com? I have only a small fragment of it, but I'd very much like a full copy. I believe I have a full copy of ftp.uu.net from October 2003, if anyone's interested. Also, I apologize if this question is considered inappropriate here, but did anyone manage to snag a full copy of the titor-special torrent? Thanks, Phil Garcia

12 years, 7 months

AT&T Blit terminal plus terminal OS

by Wesley Parish

I had a look at OSNews.com and found a story about a nifty little terminal and its OS called Blit. http://www.osnews.com/story/26315/ Blit_a_multitasking_windowed_UNIX_GUI_from_1982 I suspect getting hold of it would be like getting blood from a stone, much like getting the Research Unix source trees ... but still it would be interesting to look at if at all possible. Wesley Parish

12 years, 7 months

APL\360 Source Code Released

by Lyndon Nerenberg

After a 10-year quest, the Computer History Museum has convinced IBM to make the source code for APL\360 available to the public. The license terms are for personal use only, no copying allowed. The code itself is quite entertaining to read in some areas :-) About 37K lines of 360 macro assembler, which includes most of an interactive time-shared terminal OS environment upon which to run the APL interpreter. http://www.computerhistory.org/atchm/the-apl-programming-language-source-co… has lots of background material, and the link to the download page. Note that the links in the bibliography section on that page are broken – the all contain a spurious '.' at the end of the URL anchors. --lyndon

12 years, 7 months

Old DEC books for sale

by Warren Toomey

All, as I have to move office at the end of the year, I have a few old DEC books which I'd like to re-home to good families. I am happy to give them away, but I would like to be reimbursed for postage and packing. I've put up the details of the books at this link: http://minnie.tuhs.org/DECBooks/ Feel free to pass this on to anybody else who might be interested. Cheers, Warren

12 years, 7 months

unix guru test

by A. P. Garcia

too easy for everyone on this list :-) https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/comp.unix.questions/Dfbry3j1x6w/nF4Ic…

12 years, 7 months

Interesting comment about /usr/share/calendar.computer

by David Ryskalczyk

So I was digging around some time back, and noticed these lines in the *BSD "Computer" calendar file: 06/30 First advanced degree on computer related topic: to H. Karamanian, Temple Univ., Phila, 1948, for symbolic differentiation on the ENIAC Since I'm attending Temple, this caught my attention. However, a search for "H. Karamanian" didn't turn up anything, so I gave up. Recently, I tried again and found this: http://diamond.temple.edu/record=b1850797 In short, the name in calendar.computer is misspelled, and the date is wrong too! The correct year is 1953, at least according to that record. (I haven't looked at the actual thesis yet.) Whether this is indeed the "First advanced degree on computer related topic" is something I'm not sure about — a cursory search didn't turn up any others that predate this one, but I didn't search very far. --David R

12 years, 7 months

unix horror stories

by A. P. Garcia

i happened across this cute document in my archives... ---- *na Bblisa-Announce-Owner(a)cs.umb.edu Tue Dec 28 14:10:50 1993 *to bblisa-announce(a)cs.umb.edu *su Some notes from December 1, 1993 meeting *fr "John P. Rouillard" <rouilj(a)terminus.cs.umb.edu> *se Bblisa-Announce-Owner(a)cs.umb.edu *da Tue, 28 Dec 1993 12:42:01 -0500 *mi <199312281742.AA17997(a)cs.umb.edu> *re from cs.umb.edu (daemon(a)cs.umb.edu [158.121.104.2]) by argali.opal.com (8.6.4/jr2.9) with SMTP id OAA27752; Tue, 28 Dec 1993 14:10:43 -0500 *re by cs.umb.edu id AA18007 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for bblisa-announce-outgoing); Tue, 28 Dec 1993 12:42:08 -0500 *re from terminus.cs.umb.edu by cs.umb.edu with SMTP id AA17997 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for <bblisa-announce(a)cs.umb.edu>); Tue, 28 Dec 1993 12:42:01 -0500 *ex Precedence: bulk *tx Here are the notes from the December 1, 1993 meeting. Names have been deleted to protect the innocent. The topic was: UNIX Horror Stories (Actually Computer Horror Stories) and away we go. Story 1: A new user I knew was trying to clean out some old accounts on a system he was given. As root, he changed directories to one of the old user directories, and then did 'rm -r *' but noticed it left a directory called .X11 behind. To get rid of it, and to be sure it wouldn't fail, he did 'rm -rf .*'. Sad to say he didn't realize that '.*' could and would expand into '..', and it would continue to do so recursively. I thought this was better than the 'garden variety' 'rm -rf' scenario. The guy though, worst case, he'd blow away the old user accounts, but got the entire disk instead! Needless to say, it was time for the install disketts (yes, diskettes, about 30 of them...). Story 2: SunOS 4.0 NFS server configured with IP address 192.9.200.0 by suninstall (default - a suninstall bug) and rebooted after OS installation... (nice DECnet meltdown) Story 3: /etc/reboot - then noticing you were in the wrong window... Story 4: Coming in at 7:00AM Saturday to upgrade to Ultrix 2.2, then 5 hours later having the other guy type in rm -rf - then realising he forgot to cd out of /etc... Story 5: Having a user request some files to be restored - but forgetting when they existed except that it was "sometime around a year or so ago"... Story 6: Would you all be interested in the time a workman disassembled the cubicle containing my NIS master and dropped a 1.3 gig disk several feet to the floor ...? (Prior to telling me he was taking it apart of course ...) Story 7: talking to an end-user who just called in over the phone my root filesystem filled up, so I looked around; I found & removed vmunix and boot, and that seems to have fixed things, so I typed fastboot. Story 8: Back in the days when UNIX V6 was new, we installed it on a PDP 11/44 in the CS lab. It ran fine. We allowed students on it. It ran fine. People started using it for real work, albeit tentatively. It ran fine. It was a bit slow if several people were on -- what do you expect for a PDP11/44 -- but, it ran fine. Then occasioanlly, we started noticing that troff would go wrong and it would mis-format some portions of a document. Funnily enough, when you re-ran the job, it ran fine. We opened up the CAT. Have you ever been inside a CAT? These were serious phototypesetters. And, we could find nothing wrong with ours. After a few days of frustratedly looking for problems with the CAT, and the wiring, and the troff config, it seemed to start working OK again, so we closed it all up, and forgot about the problem. About 12 weeks later, students working on simulation class assignments started complaining that if they came in and ran their programs during the day, the programs would give the wrong results. But, if they ran the SAME programs in the evening, they'd be fine. Thinking to ourselves that students are a real pain in the ass, we took a look. Thing is, they were right. The programs DID indeed give different results depending on when you ran them. Mostly, they were OK, but occasional daytime runs were flaky. Problem with the core (yes, we had core storage on that system)? We swapped core boards. No change. We swapped CPU boards. No change. We practically swapped every board and the bus and built a new machine. No change. Of course, the number of failures were few -- the programs ran OK MOST of the time, so pinning this down was a slow process. Eventually, the students all got their assignments done, and they went on to other exercises, and we didn't have any more problems, so we got on with our lives, and forgot about it. Another 12 weeks go by. We were all happy. Life was good. The 11/44 is still running fine. Until... Aaargh! Someone using the dc calculator reported errors in the results... sometimes! And, at the same time, someone using troff reported mis-set pages. We took the machine down to single user. We ran all the programs. We turned on all sorts of debugging and tracing. Everything was fine. Nothing went wrong. We pulled our hair out! We went back multi-user. Everything was fine. We'd run dc. It was fine. We'd troff the document. It was fine. We'd go to the bar. The users would come and find us and show us printouts of their dc and troffs that had gone wrong!! Aaaargh! Well, this was one of those problems. Eventually, we made an observation. Dc works fine. Troff works fine. The simulation assignment program works fine. But... run any of them at the same time...!!!! That was it! It turned out, that these three programs used the floating point hardware. They were the ONLY programs that used the floating point hardware. Our machine had floating point hardware; the one at Bell Labs did not have. UNIX V6 was not saving the floating point registers on context switching. If you were the only floating point program on the system, this did not matter -- you context switched out, and when you switched back in, your registers were all there as you left them. But, if there was another floating point program around, your registers were corrupted! Over 8 months to diagnose the problem. Just 2 minutes to fix it! Story 9: I received umpty-three million requests at LISA, from people that wanted me to e-mail them the text of NET's infamous "Eng_Adm Get List" T-shirt. So here it is, even if you didn't want it. :-) (Eng_Adm is our systems administration mail alias) FRONT * I didn't touch a thing. * Why can`t you give me the root password? * I want more disk space, now! * It was working fine a minute ago. * I typed rm -rf, but I didn't really mean to. * How come SPARC binaries won't work on my 3/50? * I just turned it off and on a couple of times. * What's an alias? * It must be a hardware problem. * This will only take you a minute. * Can you restore /tmp/junk from February of 87? * X Windows isn't working on my VT100! * I didn't realize the type of coax made any difference. * How do I post an article to alt.sex.bondage? * I just plugged my RS-232 port into my phone jack. * Is the unix broken? * My bin directory is missing! * Someone spilled coffee on my keyboard. * I need to be the owner of all of the files in /usr/kvm. * How can I send mail to my friend on BITNET? * What makes you think it is my software? * My Mac is much easier to use. * Why is her disk quota bigger than mine? * What jumpers? * I can't login to my ethernet. * Don't you know where I put my source code? * I need to borrow your CD-ROM for 2 months. * Where can I find all of those GIF files? * Honest, it just stopped working. * But I like the old OS a lot better. * Can you read this TK50 VMS tape onto my Sun? * I can do it... I used to be a Systems Administrator. * Can`t this be done after I go home? * It says, "Run fsck manually". * I need you to reboot my floppy drive. * What does RTFM mean? * How hard can it be to do a simple upgrade? * My system just crashed. * Now how did that file get in there? * But the vendor says this should be, "Plug and play". * This is going to cost us how much!? * A System Administrator doesn't do hardware. * My machine needs more memory. * Is my monitor suppose to smoke? * Just stay late. * It was fine, until I moved the disk drive over to there. * I can guarantee you that my program is flawless. * Oops... * ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- BACK Eng_Adm "Get List" [X] A Clue [X] A Life [X] Lost Remember... just send mail. Copyright ) 1992 Network Equipment Technologies, Inc. All rights reserved. Story 10: A Dec F/S rep in to service a line printer managed to trip on the power cord to a DEC 11/750. An operator trying to be helpful immediately (no intermediate steps) plugged the power back in, faulting the system. Upon the F/S rep's request to hit the reset, a second operator hit the reset on the wrong 11/750. All mail, printing and a substantial number of other services at a small but busy academic site to came to an abrupt mid-day halt. Story 11: A system administrator logged in to a fileserver from home after two days of vacation to find her environment not working as expected. Some poking around revealed that the filesystem supporting /usr/local had been unmounted after disk problems. A call to the night operator to see if more info was available yielded the message "the system was down" waiting for F/S. The systems administrator's manager was shocked to find her in early next morning using the "dead" system's console to distribute alternate /usr/local mount configurations to the 15 desktops that received it from the server. Back tracking of the problem revealed that the system was probably pronounced dead after help desk/operations staff could not login using a non-standard shell found in /usr/local. No evidence could be found that a software support person had been consulted or that anyone other than users had actually looked at the physical system. A user was determined as being the person responsible for removing /usr/local from mount configurations and bringing the system up multiuser. Story 12 After testing a new nfs patch on a few test cases, an administrator began batch kernel installation and system reboots on 5 Sun Servers, ~50 clients, ~15 diskful desktops. One server on which the others had the several dependencies failed to reboot. This server was also the only one with a spare client slot. It had the only tape drive that could support the SunOS install tapes for it's architecture that was immediately accessible to the administrator. The system administrator determined the server could not be fixed in single user. It was not going to be possible to borrow a tape drive off hours. The administrator proceded to juggle filespace on another server to setup a client slot for booting over the net. About this time, numerous nfs woes surfaced. The administrator proceded to address references to the down server. After these had been addressed (including a few reboots), the administrator realized that the test cases hadn't determined the nfs patch would cause more problems than it solved. Life was going to be miserable until it was removed. The distribution mechanisms then in use were partially dependent on nfs, so the patch had to be backed out manually on systems that had come up. [Fortunately, the practice was to halt diskless clients and distribute nfs/lockd patches to /export/root on the servers after the servers came up using the new patch. None of the diskless clients had yet been rebooted.] Once the patches were backed out and the dead server was finally booted over the net, examination of the root filesystems revealed that a *well intentioned* person had, without informing the administrator, very recently resolved a root overflow problem by making the contents of /sbin links to /usr. -- John John Rouillard Special Projects Volunteer University of Massachusetts at Boston rouilj(a)cs.umb.edu (preferred) Boston, MA, (617) 287-6480 =============================================================================== My employers don't acknowledge my existence much less my opinions.

12 years, 7 months

Classic Unix workstation GUIs

by Michael Kerpan

The recent FOSS release of CDE has got me thinking of other Unix GUIs from the "golden age" of workstation Unix. Obviously, stuff like SunView and OpenWindows from Sun and 4DWM/Indigo Desktop from SGI are pretty well known, but I've always wondered what else was out there.So far, I've come across Looking Glass, DECWindows and HP VUE. Is there anything else of any importance/interest out there? Mike

12 years, 8 months

Re: [TUHS] Classic Unix workstation GUIs

by William von Hagen

Though Apollos were much more Unix-like than actual Unix, the DM environment (display manager?) on Apollo Aegis, Domain/IX, and Domain/OS workstations was pretty interesting, most notably for the sophisticated interaction between the command-line and GUI. The DM was a lot like the Moxie carbonated beverage - you either liked it or you really wanted to spit it out. Apollo systems also ran various versions of the X Window system, but the unique stuff was in the DM. Site such as Toastytech's GUI Timeline (http://toastytech.com/guis/guitimeline.html) and Typewritten Software's Retrotechnology Media page (http://www.typewritten.org/Media/) have many screen shots of old GUIs and apps, many on Unix or Unix-like systems. Bill

12 years, 8 months

Re: [TUHS] Classic Unix workstation GUIs

by Berny G

Open Look, Motif, NextStep. Dare I say it but I also enjoyed OS/2 Workplace.

12 years, 9 months

the origin of dotfiles

by Kuroishi Mitsuo

Hi. Just FYI. It's an interesting article about the origin of dotfiles. https://plus.google.com/101960720994009339267/posts/R58WgWwN9jp -- Kuroishi Mitsuo

12 years, 9 months

Re: [TUHS] Caldera ancient UNIX license question

by Norman Wilson

Werner Losh: However, the complicating factor here is, I think, that SYS V uses a lot of code from the later editions of Unix, so relicensing the newer research versions might cut into the license streams from them in some way. At least that was reported at the time of the only through 7th edition licensing. ======= I'm not sure who would have reported that `System V uses a lot of code from [post-7th] editions of UNIX.' I may be misled by having had my hands and eyes mainly on the kernel and the most-basic commands like the shell, but offhand I can't think of any System V code at all that was adopted directly from the Research systems in the 8th, 9th, or 10th Edition eras. There were certainly ideas that were picked up, mulled over, and re-implemented in changed form by the System V people, sometimes better and sometimes worse than the original; but not straight code transplants. The systems had diverged far too much for that to be easy. If anything, the licensing problem runs the other way: System V code taken in by the Research system. For example, the C compiler we used most was based on pcc2, developed on the System V side of the company after Steve Johnson moved there. I think our version of make may have been based on a System V version as well. I'm sure there are other (mainly smaller) examples, though since we used no source-code control mechanism, tracing the details is non-trivial. None of which invalidates the basic point: there's certainly plenty of entanglement, whether because 10/e includes ideas that were used commercially in System V and whose mutant descendants are still present in Solaris, or because 10/e includes some source code directly descended from System V. It's a shame we didn't get the several companies whose lawyers might care to agree that there's nothing of commercial value in the latter-day Research systems back when it was simpler to figure out who those companies were. As I've reported here before, there was actually some thought by certain persons here (and one who is, alas, no longer able to be here) of doing that, some years back, but a certain irksome legal circus about UNIX IP got going too quickly for that to happen, and left us with the confused situation we have today. Norman Wilson Toronto ON

12 years, 9 months

Caldera ancient UNIX license question

by סטֵפָן פָּבִיקֵבִיק

Hello all! Since by the jury of 2010 we now know that Novell, not SCO, owns the UNIX copyright, is the Caldera ancient UNIX 4-clause BSD-license still valid? Thanks in advance, God bless! - Stefan.

12 years, 9 months

Oldest Unix source code still in modern systems

by Warren Toomey

I was doing a trawl of related Unix source trees, and found that some early C code from around 2nd Edition Unix is still in OpenSolaris today: http://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=V2/cmd/if.c Choose: Compare this file to OpenSolaris_b135/cmd/fmli/sys/test.c and then click on the Side Scroll or the Printable button. There's about 15 lines of code in common between the 2 files. Cheers, Warren

13 years

Re: [TUHS] Oldest Unix source code still in modern systems

by arnold＠skeeve.com

> I was doing a trawl of related Unix source trees, and found that some early > C code from around 2nd Edition Unix is still in OpenSolaris today: If it ain't broke, don't fix it? :-)

13 years

4.4BSD installed image or login shell?

by Jeremy C. Reed

Does anyone have installation instructions (with binary distribution) or a ready-to-use image for an historical 4.4BSD (encumbered or -Lite plus needed parts or -Lite2) with gxemul, tme, or other emulator? Or any login shell available? (For my tests, I want to use the real thing instead of a *BSD from the time of the 4.4BSD-lite merge.) Thanks

13 years, 1 month

RetroBSD

by A. P. Garcia

2.11 BSD ported to a mips-based microcontroller: http://retrobsd.org/ http://olimex.wordpress.com/2012/04/04/unix-on-pic32-meet-retrobsd-for-duin…

13 years, 1 month

man.cat-v.org

by Norman Wilson

I ran across this web site, which conveniently hosts man pages for a number of bell labs operating systems. Does anyone have the man pages for 9th or 10th edition that you could please share? That's problematic. Neither the limited-release V8 tape, the even-more-limited V9 (I'm not sure there even was a single such release, maybe we just sent out a few snapshots), nor the never-really-sent-to-anyone 10th Edition system has ever, so far as I know, escaped its original restrictive licensing. That includes the manual pages as well as the software proper. 10/e is even tricker, because it was published as a book; the ordinary book copyright on the contents may apply. And since all that stuff is 20 years or more, and several corporate reorgs/splits/buyouts, in the past, it may be very hard to find anyone who will agree that the stuff is no longer of any commercial value (the software all long since outdated, the printed book long out of print). Warren and Dennis and I talked about this many years ago. As I recall, we concluded that if we could get at least one of AT&T, Lucent, or the then-believed-owner of the UNIX commercial intellectual property to say it was OK, the others would likely go along; Warren had at the time a good contact with the latter entity; but said entity was still settling down after a buyout, so it seemed wisest to wait a few months before pushing for anything more. Alas, said entity was Caldera, which had just bought up The Santa Cruz Operation. Before a few months had passed, they had rebranded themselves as The SCO Group and shifted their primary business from technology development to pursuing untenable legal claims. I've no idea where one would start these days even to find the Gordian knot, let alone to cut it. Norman Wilson Toronto ON (who wrote some of them there manual pages, and some of the software they describe too, all a long time ago in a hill atop a swamp far far away) Email secured by Check Point

13 years, 1 month

man.cat-v.org

by A. P. Garcia

13 years, 1 month

Understanding the /bin, /sbin, /usr/bin, /usr/sbin Split

by A. P. Garcia

http://www.osnews.com/story/25556/Understanding_the_bin_sbin_usr_bin_usr_sb…

13 years, 2 months

"Slow system call" and EINTR

by Dan Stromberg

I gather system calls can return EINTR only when they are "slow". True? What makes a system call "slow"? Is it the ability to block for a while? But I wouldn't think dup(2) would block, for example. (I -=Love=- *ix!)

13 years, 2 months

Re: [TUHS] why the leading under score added to function names?

by arnold＠skeeve.com

Hi All. This is interesting. It shows that (apparently) early on, assembler was viewed as the primary programming language. It also shows the consequences a small, apparently local decision can have: here we are 40+ years later and GCC on Windows is still preprending underscores to function names! In 15 minutes I helped the guy at work solve a problem he'd been working on for two days! Thanks everyone, Arnold > From: Brantley Coile <brantley(a)coraid.com> > To: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)horsfall.org> > Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:34:26 -0600 > Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society <tuhs(a)tuhs.org> > Subject: Re: [TUHS] why the leading under score added to function names? > > correct. we could link to assembler code with _entry points and not i> worry about symbol collisions in the rest of the code. > > iPhone email > > On Feb 20, 2012, at 6:23 PM, "Dave Horsfall" <dave(a)horsfall.org> wrote: > > > On Mon, 20 Feb 2012, arnold(a)skeeve.com wrote: > > > > [...] > > > >> I'm pretty sure this dates back to PDP-11 days. I'm wondering "why?". > >> Why did the C compiler prepend an underscore to function names? > > > > Sure was the PDP-11 :-) I vaguely recall that it was to make sure that > > user functions did not conflict with predefined assembler functions, as > > that would be a pain to diagnose (much like having swap overlap root). > > > > -- Dave

13 years, 3 months

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TUHS